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821558 No. 821558 ID: 65a774

“And so it all comes to an end, old friend, with a simple choice.”

-Fate.

Discussion: http://tgchan.org/kusaba/questdis/res/92354.html
Wiki and previous threads: http://tgchan.org/wiki/Strange_Bedfellows
675 posts omitted. Last 50 shown. Expand all images
>>
No. 845234 ID: b9b4da

Divvy up the curse between Chronicler, Dreamer and Fate instead, watch them destroy each other over infighting.
>>
No. 845264 ID: 1ce946

Can we choose neither? Like can we take the power from him but then instead of using it or keeping it or what ever we just let it disperse or fade something? A world without gods.
but maybe fix what happened when we were going through the catacombs before giving up the power, like your fingers, Thalia, Sisah, your sister?
>>
No. 845288 ID: fe7355

>>845264
I'd say hold on to that power a bit longer to search the world for any other hiding old gods or Runes of Eternity or other nasty surprises from the last age. Then remove them so there won't be a chance of another god ascending or some other shit that'd pop up to wreck the world. Also remove all record of what the real shape of the Rune of Eternity is from the world, including written, chiseled in stone or remembered in memory, including from Kronos' mind. Leave the only memory of its real form Chronicler's.
>>
No. 845297 ID: 65a774
File 151078307304.png - (64.42KB , 686x526 , 136.png )
845297

:KronosSB: …okay, first off I have a question. Several in fact.
:FateSB: Ask away. We have all the time in the world, after all.
:KronosSB: In that case... Who is Cain? Or better yet, what is Cain? He clearly isn’t mortal.
:FateSB: Cain? He is… another actor of destiny, a mask for Fate to wear.
:DreamerSB: I still have many dreams of action he will do.
:ChroniclerSB: There are still history that will be written by his actions.
:KronosSB: That didn’t explain anything!
:FateSB: Didn’t we? Why are you so inclined to know who he is?
:KronosSB: Because he is a friend! And… and I don’t know if I can trust him anymore! What if he tries to steal the power for himself or something!?
:FateSB: The Power coming from the River of Souls is in your hands and your hands only. While he still have many roads to build, his role here is over.
:DreamerSB: The dreams I have is of the future, not the here and now.
:ChroniclerSB: There will be nothing written about him for a generation. He has done his part for now… and he will do his part in the future, long after your story is over.
:KronosSB: …so what you’re telling me is not to worry about him?
:FateSB: It would be for the best, yes.

:KronosSB: Can I bring people back to life?
:FateSB: Ah, you mean Sisah and Doxan?
:DreamerSB: It is… possible, but I wouldn’t recommend it. I’ve had nightmares of that…
:ChroniclerSB: You can bring them back… but history show us that they wouldn’t be… the same. At best you might have to deal with someone that can only lie twitching on the floor and drool… at worse… well…
:DreamerSB: *Shudder* The blood…
:ChroniclerSB: Unless you use the power to change history itself… but the amount of power that would take… it’s beyond even a god.

:KronosSB: Right… next question, can’t we just share the power between us?
:FateSB: Ah, there is a bit of a catch with power. You need power to wield power… thus, if you don’t have enough… well…
:DreamerSB: You’ll go boom thanks to overindulgence of mana.
:FateSB: At best only one of you will die… at worse both of you will “survive”.
:ChroniclerSB: Imagen it’s a dam linked to the river. If you don’t ride on top of the wave when it breaks you’ll simply drown, and there is only place for one at the top.
:KronosSB: …so I’m guessing I can’t just take some of the power?
:ChroniclerSB: Again, a dam. It would be like trying to stop it from flooding a whole valley with your bare hands.
:KronosSB: And if I just let the power flow away?
:ChroniclerSB: You’ll flood the village in the center of the valley… in this case, Risavia and the nations next to them will… cease. In fire… lots of fire…
:FateSB: So there is only two paths you can take. Who will it be? Who will become the new god of th-

:KronoSB: NO! FUCK THAT!
:FateSB: But the web of fate says-
:KronosSB: FUCK FATE! FUCK THE GODS! FUCK BELSETH! Not literally… except maybe the last one… but later.
:FateSB: But doing nothing will mean that Belseth will-
:KronosSB: No… I will break this dam… and instead of riding the wave I will simply redirect it! I will do what the gods’ lust for power never let them… I will use the power here and now instead of ascending! I WILL REWRITE REALITY ITSELF!
:FateSB: B-but… but the web of f-fate… you can’t j-just-
:KronosSB: I AM THE FUCKING PHOENIX! I will throw off the shackles of fate and make my own path!
:FateSB: T-this can’t be- This isn’t how it’s supposed to- You’ll mess up everything! Stop this nonsense!
:DreamerSB: Though… do you believe you are capable?
:ChroniclerSB: Do you know what needs to be done? With great power comes great responsibility, after all. I know you, Kronos, and you aren’t the most… responsible people.
:KiraSB: But I am.
>>
No. 845298 ID: 65a774
File 151078308147.png - (63.53KB , 686x526 , 137.png )
845298

:KronosSB: Sis!? Y-you’re alive?
:KiraSB: Apparently I am.
:DreamerSB: The Six souls was used instead of that of your sister… and brothers.
:KiraSB: But what’s important is that I know what will need to be mended in our nation.
:DreamerSB: Ah, yes… yes… I see it in my dreams… with her guidance… and your compassion…
:KiraSB: Together we will lead the world into a new golden age.
:DreamerSB: Not exactly… but you will make the world a far better place… with a far brighter future.
:KiraSB: …which is good enough. So what do you say, Kronos, can I aid you in making-

:SonorkSB: HOLD IT!
>>
No. 845299 ID: 65a774
File 151078309024.png - (44.84KB , 686x526 , 138.png )
845299

:SonorkSB: We both know who is at fault for the way the world turned out. We know how one of our actions changed the course of history for the worse!
:KiraSB: Wait? Kronos?
:KronosSB: Wait, what are you… err… me doing here?
:SonorkSB: Saving your sorry ass… again. This is your fault, after all.
:ChroniclerSB: I wouldn’t say fault but he does speak the truth, Kronos, some of your actions are the reason things turned out so dire.
:SonorkSB: So I suggest, instead of trying to repair something that is unrepairable, we simply change the course of history! We go back and change the single action that started this whole mess. We make it so mom never died… and the war never started.
:ChroniclerSB: There could be enough power to accomplished something like that, yes… and it would mean the war would never happen. Instead, the diplomatic tension between the Empire and your kingdom will dissipate… and an alliance, far stronger than the one you’ve so desperately formed today, would be born.
:SonorkSB: And the war wouldn’t feed the gods, thus this whole ordeal would never happen.
:ChroniclerSB: Actually, as you’ve destroyed the rune of eternity, the old man will simply collect them as soon as the change is done. After all, forever is in both directions, so the rune is broken today as well as tomorrow and yesterday.
:SonorkSB: Even better. So, what say you, Kronos, do you want to go back and right what once went wrong?
>>
No. 845300 ID: 65a774
File 151078310366.png - (84.86KB , 686x526 , 139.png )
845300

:KiraSB: Now hold on a moment! We can’t just go back and fix our mistakes like that. We’re supposed to learn and grow from them, not just unmake them.
:SonorkSB: Learn what? That starvation is bad? That massive corruption mess up our country? That war kills people? Are learning experience really that much important then the life of thousands!?
:DreamerSB: We still learn if we remember the mistake we made, even if we undid it.
:KiraSB: Weren’t you on my side?
:DreamerSB: Oh, I am. I would rather see the future change than the past.
:ChroniclerSB: And I rather see history written in a new way. But we aren’t here to convince each other, are we? We are her to convince Kronos. He is the one who will make the choice.

:SonorkSB: Then let me begin with a simple fact. The war killed hundreds of thousands, laid waste to our economy, despoiled our farmlands and gave the already rich and powerful even more power to abuse. Starvation, corruption and death… and we can unmake it all in one action.
:KiraSB: It will take work, but we can overcome all of that… and come out stronger from it! We can learn, grow and change so that it won’t happen again. What is stopping history to repeat itself, just against another opponent at another time?
:SonorkSB: Families was torn apart, life was lost, people were scarred both physically and mentally. That includes your family! Your mother and brothers are dead, your father is dying of grief and your sister is… well. We won’t heal from this, even with the power you’ll get… no, the life that was lost can only be brought back one way and one way only.
:KiraSB: And of those that was born after that event? You will make hundreds of thousands people to never be born!
:SonorkSB: Others will be born in their place!
:KiraSB: What gives you the right to decide who will be born or not!?
:SonorkSB: What gives you the right to decide who will die or not!?
:KiraSB: What gives you the right to bring them back!? No, let me bring out the big swords. Briannah, your beloved wife… if the war never happened, you would never have met her.
:DreamerSB: And the children you have will never be made.
:KronosSB: Wait, children?
:ChroniclerSB: She is bearing twins… and Zela is with your child as well.
:SonorkSB: Are you really going to throw thousands upon thousands of lives away because you want to protect your own blood? What a hero you are. No, then let retort. Briannah is… broken. She has experience more things that no one deserves to… and it has left her scarred. You know she will never be alright again, that she will always be unwell. She might not be suicidal anymore, but the path she took to get there will not be forgotten.
:DreamerSB: It is true. Her past will haunt her forever. Her scars will never heal fully.
:ChroniclerSB: Her past cuts to deep.
:KiraSB: We can fix th-
:SonorkSB: NO! NO YOU WILL NOT! You will not brainwash my love, you will not remake her brain nor will you remove her trauma. She is Briannah, my love, and I will not let you force her to change against her will. No… what I ask is to give her a past… and a future where she will be whole… will be happy… and loved… even if that isn’t a future we are in. I love her just as you do Kronos, and I would give everything to see her truly happy.
:DreamerSB: …she would find a future where she was happy if you changed the past.
:ChroniclerSB: But she will find one in this timeline as well… just one that’s a bit more… scarred.

:SonorkSB: And there we have it… will you save thousands, save our nation, save Briannah… or will you be selfish and only do it for yourself? Are you a hero, Kronos, or just a spoiled prince who can’t make sacrifices for the greater good?
:KiraSB: Those that doesn’t learn are doomed to repeat the mistakes of the past. From where we are now, with the power we are given, we can do so much more than just prevent a war. We can truly change the future for the better… and not just bet that it will by undoing our past mistakes. We can make a better tomorrow… for your children, Kronos.
:ChroniclerSB: In the end, your choice will change the world… and history itself.
:DreamerSB: There are many paths ahead of you, Kronos, but these two are the only ones that will end well. Trust me on that one.
:FateSB: B-but… my web… it’s g-going to be ruined! I must r-redo everything from scratch! *Sob*…

…do you change the past with the help of Chronicler and… um… other you?
…or the future with the help of Dreamer and Kira?
>>
No. 845312 ID: a633c6

What would your mother want for you?
>>
No. 845313 ID: 094652

>Retcon souls
Normally I'd oppose this, but... well, they'll all be reincarnated eventually. I'd rather chose the option that eventually gives people the choice to defy this. SO:

>vote
One final question: which choice brings about a future filled with science, discovery, and the will to live life to the fullest? My vote's for that one.
>>
No. 845319 ID: a633c6

Also, why is Kira so attached to this timeline? And since she's the responsible one, shouldn't you listen to her? And unless I've messed up my chronology, wouldn't Bri still be down her particular path even if the war didn't start and not have that revelation she had not too long ago? And wouldn't those radical factions that started the war, including Elete, still be alive and full of wicked ambition? I'm not so convinced things are guaranteed to turn out better if we try again, and we've only got one chance to use this trump card.
>>
No. 845320 ID: 51b8ec

As wild of a ride as it has been, I vouch for accepting the past, as scarred as it has been, and embrace the future with Kira and the Dreamer. With Briannah and the twins.

Messing with the past would likely only end up with another flavor of disaster anyways.
>>
No. 845321 ID: 3ce125

Wait, more questions. If we rewrite the past, will a Dragon-Phoenix hybrid offspring still be created? Xuv was talking about using that to defy fate, yet Krotos got manipulated by Nightmare and that never came to pass, and we killed Xuv's soul so that she couldn't use Kronos' child as a vessel to (I assume) overthrow the Six and rule on her own. With the war prevented, would Krotos and Briannah ever meet? Would they be able to have a child without Xuv's blessing? Would ANYONE be able to make a hybrid if we rewrite the past?

Secondly, how exactly would Kira's choice work? How would we take power away from the nobility without them immediately taking it back? I mean, Kira's choice implies that everyone still remembers everything that happened, so anything we change will result in people going "what the fuck just happened?" and possibly refusing to accept the new situation. According to the Dreamer it will work in the end, but I'd like to know exactly how. I suspect the methods involved are unsavory.

Another option I was considering was not directly rewriting the past, but simply allowing Life to reclaim the Six's souls at an earlier point as if we had. This would prevent the Nightmare from manipulating events, which is what caused both of Kronos' brothers to go nuts. The war might still happen but events DURING and AFTER the war would change. Maybe it would end earlier? Maybe we could avoid the worst changes in Varkian government? Has the Dreamer considered this option? It would certainly be the most hands-off option. Fate's web might even be partially intact. ...is that a good thing though? Fate intended all these horrible things to happen. Maybe we should give him the big middle finger. "Old friend" my ass, what was he even talking about there? Heck, ask him why he called you an old friend.

The biggest middle finger would be, of course, ensuring that Dragon-Phoenix hybrids exist. Those are apparently the most anathema to Fate that there is.
>>
No. 845322 ID: 3ce125

>>845319
>Briannah would still be addicted to sex if the war didn't happen
Hey that's right. Is the Dreamer lying to us about her being happy if we change the past?
>>
No. 845323 ID: 0764a8

>>845300
Change the past. If it was your actions that led to this outcome, then your happiness is the price you will pay for that of others'.
>>
No. 845325 ID: c2051e

>>845300
Let's solve this with the usual methods. Start sodomizing everyone including both of your selves until something starts working.
>>
No. 845330 ID: 2c8807

>>845300
Look, hindsight is 20/20, everyone in the world thinks they know how they'd make the everything better if they just had the chance to go back and right a wrong that was done.

But all actions have consequences, nobody is above that.
Other You is right and always will be, but even changing history won't fix everything. That voice of regret won't go away, there will always be something you didn't say or do, something you want to change.

It's wrong to wipe away the past, present and futures of so many others in order to indulge that wish even once.
You'll just have to do what everyone else has to: live with the memories of the past and work for a better future.
>>
No. 845331 ID: 33cbe7

Past. Roll the dice on a brave new world!
>>
No. 845343 ID: 3ce125

...if you change the past, will you forget you had done so? Will you become the immature, irresponsible playboy you were before you met Briannah? Also what's going to happen to Belseth if you change the past? You only asked about Briannah. He was a war hero. What will he do if there will never be a war? Will Elete be Archbishop again? Was she merely manipulated or was she a willing accomplice? She might get up to something terrible.

Lastly, you now know the truth about the Six. If you change the past, people will continue worshipping the Five, not knowing that they are dead. Not knowing what they did. People will try to become gods again someday, not knowing how bad an idea it is. It's not the lessons taught by the war that we should be worried about. It's the lessons taught by the gods.
>>
No. 845360 ID: 91ee5f

>>845297
>You can bring them back…but history show us that they wouldn’t be…the same. At best you might have to deal with someone that can only lie twitching on the floor and drool…at worse…well…
>*Shudder* The blood…
So it's like Full Metal Alchemist when the Elric brothers try to bring their mom back to life? Ok then. Don't bring people back to life.

>>845298
Wait a minute! Waaaiiit a minute!

Kira, how the fuck can you see and hear what these guys are saying?!

>>845299
Other Kronos is here too?!

Ok, how do I know if either of you are real?! Because Kira is supposed to be laying unconscious on that table in the middle of the room and she can't see or hear Chronicler, Fate, or Dreamer! And.....other me, is supposed to be in my head and not outside of it!

Even though both of you are making good points in your arguments, both of you can't be real! Is this some kinda trick that Fate is trying to pull to make me not mess up its web?!

>>845300
>She is bearing twins…and Zela is with your child as well.
Wait, Zela is also.....?!

.....we're not looking forward to explaining that.

>>845319
This is true!

Would changing the past really stop others with wicked ambitions?

>>845330
This!

Everyone always wants to have the power to change the past, but that doesn't mean that the change would be best for everyone!

>>
No. 845371 ID: 3ce125

Hey, if the only thing we do with the past is to get Life to capture the Six earlier than usual, would we still have the power to change the future/present? I kindof want to annoy all three time-siblings.
>>
No. 845377 ID: 3ce125

...oooh, what if... Fate worked alongside us on this? We push Life into the past to get rid of Nightmare, but Fate ensures that most events go along the same lines as they did before?

I dunno, nobody else seems to want to support me on this hands-off approach to altering the past, but it would get what we wanted done instead of these two options which only do half of what we want. I don't really want to trust that the Dreamer has accounted for this choice, since the Dreamer wasn't aware before that we could choose anything other than who to ascend.
>>
No. 845467 ID: fe7355

Okay, you want to hold up on deciding for awhile. This is the fate of the world we're talking about, after all. You want to ask questions and triple-check you're clear on everything. It's the prudent and sensible thing to do. And Fate said you have all the time you could want to deliberate and think before you finally decide. Can you conjure up the memory of comfy chairs for us to sit in and fine tea to drink while you contemplate this choice?

Now, there's a great threat lying over the horizon that you have, rather ironically, forgotten about: The Forgotten One. Chronicler and Dreamer can tell you what is, now possible and how dire the threat of the Forgotten One's rise would be. But from what bits you've picked up so far, from Dreamer, your mirror self's tirade and from when you met the Six-in-Krotos'-form (the text in the image from >>/questarch/805744) you gather it represents not just a existential threat to the world but to reality itself, and that it is a for a future generation to face. And so you must ask which of these two choices before you leaves a world that has better odds of stopping the Forgotten One, because that is the one you will choose. For if the price of failure is the end of everything, then you must choose the best odds possible.

However, this presents a third possible choice, a variant of the 'change the future' one: Use this power to remove the threat of the Forgotten One right now so it will never come to pass. Remove any chance that the Forgotten One will rise in the future by destroying it in the present. For no matter how prepared that future generation is to stop the Forgotten One's rise, there's always the chance all the dice will come up ones and they will fail. And the price of failure then will be the unmaking of everything that is, was and will ever be. In the light of such stakes, spending some, or even all, of this great power to make sure that threat never comes to pass does make sense. But you have to ask Dreamer what the possible results of this would be.

You have to wonder just what your mirror self is. You thought it was a manifestation of your self-loathing, then your suppressed "ruthless" side, but now that he has appeared right now you aren't so sure what he is. A manifestation of the thin blood of Ifocen that runs through your veins? Who you would have been if your mother had not died? What do Chronicler and Dreamer say this other you is? And how did he, before you reconciled, knew and saw so much, albeit warped by his dark view of you? Especially about the Forgotten One.

Question to Chronicler and Dreamer: If you choose to change the past, how much of what we have learned in this timeline be lost? Because without the Six's hints, the crypt of the gods would not be discovered and the true fate of the Five revealed. Without what has happened, we would not know so surely that mortals should not become gods, or how and why the world of the Old Empire collapsed. And most of all, we'd lose the forewarning of the Forgotten One's potential rise.

>>845319
>And unless I've messed up my chronology, wouldn't Bri still be down her particular path even if the war didn't start and not have that revelation she had not too long ago?
No, because it was Briannah's father's death in a battle in the early years of the war that turned her down the path she went. Losing him was her first deep emotional trauma. No war means Bri's father wouldn't die leading troops into battle and he would raise her instead of a emotionally distant army friend of his that felt obligated to.

>>845377
>We push Life into the past to get rid of Nightmare, but Fate ensures that most events go along the same lines as they did before?
>I dunno, nobody else seems to want to support me on this hands-off approach to altering the past, but it would get what we wanted done instead of these two options which only do half of what we want.
I don't know where you're getting the idea it would get the best of both worlds, because as far as I can tell it'd end up even worse. If events go so close along the lines they did before that it'd result in a world close to what it is now that wouldn't be any better. Kronos' mom is still dead, a devastating war still happens with all the consequences of that. And then Fate would have to make a hell of a lot of changes with Karas, Krotos, Elete and everyone else influenced by the Nightmare Six to have 'em behave close enough to how they behaved before to get a outcome close to what happened in this timeline.

And in the end it'd be even worse because there wouldn't be the magical power to make a brighter future because it had already been used up to make a past that was almost but not quite the same as it was before. And on top of that because Xuv isn't around to suppress Kronos' fear of Sakkilians, he'll have to take the long and fraught road to overcome his fear to find his love for Briannah. ...And Kronos may not even live that long, because Krotos won't be around to save Kronos from those deadly spores in the royal crypt.
>>
No. 845474 ID: 1e7aa8

Anyone who fucks with the past is doomed to failure. Change the future for the better instead. Take the power from Belseth, listen to Zela and everyone else. DO NOT BRING ANYONE BACK FROM THE DEAD.
>>
No. 845502 ID: 88bd6f

So no war means no arranged marriage to Bri, no meeting Bel, no kids and going forward means no Sisah or Doxan or mother or those to brothers who's names I don't care about you know the ones.
Both these outcomes are bullshit.

There's no real guarantee that working towards a better future will actually beget a better future and are we 100% sure that changing the past will actually stop the war?
If we change the past we will still remember everything that happen in this timeline right? Is there a way to have everyone currently in the catacombs also remember?
I honestly don't know which to choose both have too many cons.
>>
No. 845508 ID: 3ce125

You know, since we still can't come to a consensus we should probably get some more people in here to talk about it. A bunch of our friends are still alive. Thalia might not be very helpful though.

Also we can ask Briannah directly if she wants her mind messed with, if we decide not to change the past at all.
>>
No. 845510 ID: 1e7aa8

>>845508
Uh, no. Pretty sure that the time siblings aren't going to cater to our every indecisive whim.

ALSO psychic brainwashing is a HORRIFIC IDEA even with all the best intentions in the world.
>>
No. 845516 ID: fe7355

Ask how far back in time could be rolled back with the power at hand, both with and without changes to the past. Because the farther back the negative influence of the Nightmare Six is removed, the better you think things would go. How would things turn out in those scenarios?

And you have a idea for a possibly better variant on changing the past you want to run by Dreamer and Chronicler. What if in addition to making the small change that heads off the war, you send back a thick tome containing a complete detailed account of what happened in this timeline and the knowledge from it that would be lost otherwise to a few who would be most receptive to that knowledge and have the means to put it to good use. A incontrovertible gift of dire warnings and hard earned knowledge sent at great cost from a dark and bloody future, containing that which could not be known otherwise. Forewarning of the Forgotten One. The truth of the Six and how the Old Empire fell. Where the Crypt of the Gods is. Personal experiences from all those involved. All wrapped up in a tome with a Old Empire preservation enchantment upon it. Would this be possible, and how would things turn out if this was done?
>>
No. 845518 ID: b9b4da

Rewind time as far as possible with this power and remove the Six from living memory.
>>
No. 845530 ID: fe7355

>>845502
>So no war means no arranged marriage to Bri, no meeting Bel, no kids and going forward means no Sisah or Doxan or mother or those to brothers who's names I don't care about you know the ones.
>Both these outcomes are bullshit.
You apparently forgot that changing the past would mean there's no 17 years long war that killed hundreds of thousands total between both Risavia and the Empire, trashed the economy of both, befouled and left the farmland untended leading to famine, and left both nations in such a bad state from war exhaustion they had to ally with each other, their hated enemy, out of sheer necessity, lest they be overrun by neighboring nations. That Kronos never has to marry Briannah and gets the opportunity to fall in love with her and have a family with her, and that he doesn't get to meet Belseth and have a romance with him, is very small in comparison.

>There's no real guarantee that working towards a better future will actually beget a better future and are we 100% sure that changing the past will actually stop the war?
Nothing is 100% sure, but it can get damn close. And we have Dreamer. It can say what the odds are. And from what we've gathered, it'd only take a small change. Just make sure 3 year old Kronos doesn't want to return to the palace to play with his toys so his mother and him don't leave the peace summit out where the ultra-nationalist Imperials can get at 'em. Either distract him at the crucial point or leave something interesting for him to play with. If little Kronos is anything like adult Kronos in the attention department, he'll forget about leaving half a minute later.
>>
No. 845534 ID: a5e143

Going back in time always causes more trouble than it solves.
>>
No. 845539 ID: 91ee5f

>>845534
Agreed!
>>
No. 845541 ID: 3ce125

Well, if the consensus winds up being to change the present/future, we should at least get Briannah in here to ask if she wants her PHYSICAL scars healed.

Also obviously Kronos should heal himself.
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No. 845583 ID: fe7355

To summarize and clarify, as of now my order of preferences are, in order of most to lesser: Use the power here and now to remove the Forgotten One and its threat to the future and reality, then use whatever power is left to better the world.

If that is not possible, either because there isn't enough power or for some other reason, then use the power to not just change the past but also send back written record of what happened in this timeline. This is to, among other warnings and knowledge that would otherwise be lost or not discovered, warn of the coming threat of the Forgotten One.

If sending a written record back as well is not possible, then use the power for whichever of the two listed options will result in a world better prepared and more likely to stop the Forgotten One. I think it'll be the one where the power is used now to better the future, since in it we'll know of the coming threat and to prepare, but whichever one Dreamer says has better odds you'll go for.

However, if either of the first two is possible but Dreamer or Chronicler point out severe downsides or repercussions to either of them you have not thought of, then you'll have to reconsider.
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No. 845588 ID: 91ee5f

Let's not change the past. Time travel of any kind usually ends badly!
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No. 845722 ID: 65a774
File 151095175407.png - (32.77KB , 686x526 , End.png )
845722

>What would your mother want for you?
She would want you to be happy… and a responsible Prince who cared for his nation…
>Wouldn't Bri still be down her particular path even if the war didn't start and not have that revelation she had not too long ago?
She started walking that path when her father died in the war… so if there wasn’t a war, she would never have lost him in the first place.

>Kira, how the fuck can you see and hear what these guys are saying?!
:KiraSB: I… I’m not entirely sure? …and why do I already know who you are?
:DreamerSB: Because you’re dreaming Kronos… we brought you into your dreams so we could discuss this.
:ChroniclerSB: And with Kira unconscious nearby it was easy to bring her in as well.
:KronosSB: And my other self over there?
:DreamerSB: That’s your own creation. Another part of your mind.
>We should probably get some more people in here to talk about it.
:ChroniclerSB: There is no one else that’s nearby.
:DreamersSB: Well, no one that’s alive… or asleep.

>Fate intended all these horrible things to happen.
:FateSB: Intended!? What I intended was that I would be able to get back home and enjoy a fine cup of tea before tomorrow, but now with the mess you made with the web…
:KronosSB: …you have homes? And tea?
:ChroniclerSB: We technically don’t. But Fate is right, it didn’t intend anything.
:DreamerSB: Ironically, Fate is far harsher bound by destiny than any mortal. It is one of the few things that can’t choose a path for itself, instead you make your own fate.
:FateSB: And I was really hoping my path would involve tea… I like tea…
>Heck, ask him why he called you an old friend.
:FateSB: Because I’ve always been by your side, old friend, ever since you were born. You are destined for great things, so Fate will follow you wherever you go.

>Why is Kira so attached to this timeline?
:KiraSB: Those that seek to change the past are doomed to failure.
:FateSB: Her pride can’t admit that things might get better without her help.
:KiraSB: T-that’s not- I’m not- That’s a lie and you know it!
>Wouldn't those radical factions that started the war, including Elete, still be alive and full of wicked ambition?
:ChroniclerSB: Without a cataclysm to start the war they so desire, their machinations will fail.
:DreamerSB: They either see reason or a noose… sometimes both.

>There's no real guarantee that working towards a better future will actually beget a better future.
:DreamerSB: Isn’t that the beauty of it? No matter how hard you try, sometimes you might just fail anyway. You can never be sure if you made the right decision… but what you can do is to try and make it the right choice.
>We have Dreamer. It can say what the odds are.
:DreamerSB: Actually, Fate is the one who count the odds.
:FateSB: The chance of you choosing that neither you nor Belseth would ascend was approaching zero! This isn’t supposed to be possible? Did… did someone manipulate the web!?
:ChroniclerSB: *Whistles innocently*
>Are we 100% sure that changing the past will actually stop the war?
:ChroniclerSB: You have my word. How much you value it is up to you, Kronos.
>Is the Dreamer lying to us about her being happy if we change the past?
:DreamerSB: You have my word as well. It’s value is about forty danar on the market of Cara’zil.
:ChroniclerSB: Cara’zil haven’t existed for forty thousand year.
:DreamerSB: Exactly, it’s priceless!
:FateSB: Or worthless…

>Which choice brings about a future filled with science, discovery, and the will to live life to the fullest?
:DreamerSB: Both or neither. One action might change the world, but people will still make their own destinies.
>With the war prevented, would Krotos and Briannah ever meet?
:DreamerSB: Possibly.
>If we rewrite the past, will a Dragon-Phoenix hybrid offspring still be created?
:DreamerSB: Possibly.
>What's going to happen to Belseth if you change the past?
:DreamerSB: Possibly.
:KronosSB: That doesn’t even- are you just messing with me?
:DreamerSB: He would possibly be happy. He is intelligent, driven and good hearted, I’m sure he would find a place in the world by himself.

>...if you change the past, will you forget you had done so?
:ChroniclerSB: Having the memories of two lives would drive most people mad so…
:DreamerSB: It will be like a dream…
:ChroniclerSB: …and the closer you are to the epicenter the more lucid it will be.
:FateSB: …and seeing as you’re standing on it, yes, yes you will remember it.
:DreamerSB: Most of it. As a dream that felt real.
>Will you become the immature, irresponsible playboy you were before you met Briannah?
:FateSB: How can you become something you already are?
:ChroniclerSB: How can you not become something else when so much will change?
:DreamerSB: How can you not become something else if you don’t change the past?
>If you change the past, people will continue worshipping the Five, not knowing that they are dead.
:FateSB: They will continue to worship them if you don’t change the past as well.
:ChroniclerSB: Just because you and some other know the truth, doesn’t mean everyone else will simply accept it.
:DreamerSB: Many have worshipped those that don’t exist in the past… many do so today… and many more will do so in the future. You alone cannot change that fact.
>What if in addition to making the small change that heads off the war, you send back a thick tome containing a complete detailed account of what happened in this timeline
:ChroniclerSB: You don’t have enough power for that.
:FateSB: Changing history is… hard. There is a reason why people aren’t changing it all the time.
:DreamerSB: All you can send back is a single though… just enough to change the mind of child you at a critical moment.
:ChroniclerSB: Though… I do have some ideas for later…
:FateSB: Are you messing around with the mortal world again!?
:ChroniclerSB: Oh, no, of course not…

>Secondly, how exactly would Kira's choice work? How would we take power away from the nobility without them immediately taking it back?
:KiraSB: I do have several plans, but they will take time. First, we need to strengthen the standing of the common folk… to make sure they can push back against the elite…
:DreamerSB: …and start a civil war?
:KiraSB: I was planning to not let that happen. It is possible, correct?
:DreamerSB: Possibly.
>Use this power to remove the threat of the Forgotten One right now so it will never come to pass.
:ChroniclerSB: Oh… I’m not even sure the power of a god can stand up to it…
:DreamerSB: Nor do we know what to do even if it did. It is forgotten… thus we can’t remember how to combat it… or stop it… or what it is.
:FateSB: Not even you can damage the center of the web. It will come to pass, no matter what happens.
:KronosSB: Great… I really hope I’m long dead by then…

:FateSB: So… have you decided yet? What will you do?
:KronosSB: …I do believe I know what I need to do, yes…

To make it easier for me to count the votes, please use the finely crafted link below to vote.
http://www.strawpoll.me/14423231
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No. 845732 ID: 3ce125

>>845722
So, the Forgotten One will cause trouble no matter what we choose here, and people in the Palace will still remember the redacted history. "Possibly" isn't a good enough answer for us having access to a hybrid if we change the past, though. We need that to come to pass.

...considering Briannah is nearby, she'll remember some of this too. How about this: we change the past, then seek out Briannah and get started on making her pregnant again? Kira can help you with that since she's VERY close and will remember a lot of it.
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No. 845742 ID: a633c6

> There is no one else that’s nearby.
Really? Not even Belseth?
>Her pride can’t admit that things might get better without her help.
That's stupid. This entire time she's dreaded the responsibility she's been saddled with to the point of absolute self destruction, now she wants to make bold new plans for the future?

What about changing the present, does Fate want to make a pitch? and what are we going to do with that 'suit of armor'?
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No. 845743 ID: 91ee5f

>>845722
>And I was really hoping my path would involve tea…I like tea…
"So do I. In fact, I think we could all use a nice cup of tea."

<_<

>_>

".....guess I'll have to get used to Cain not appearing out of nowhere with tea anymore."

>Great…I really hope I’m long dead by then…
That shouldn't be a problem, as long as you don't keep the power and become immortal.

>Vote
I voted!

And if it wins then, Kronos should tell Kira that he trusts her judgment, but he should let her know that whatever her plans are, they shouldn't rely on him keeping this power because as soon as Kronos uses it for what is needed, he's going to give up this power. Keeping it would feel wrong, especially since this power is what caused all of this to happen in the first place!

.....and whisper that if she wants, Kronos can help fix Kira's "problem" so that she could one day have a child of her own. Obviously, Kronos isn't going to be the father.
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No. 845786 ID: 094652

>Cure fertility and other crippling injuries
I get the feeling that would be an abuse of power, but there should be enough to spare for a pouch of personal use.

Incidentally, if you DO retcon the past, what exactly are you going to do? Give baby Kronos his toys? Trip up the assassins so Sisah gets to them in time? Literally time-travel and defeat the assassins yourself, including a "I am you from the future, there's no time to explain, follow me to the - SIX BE DAMNED! AAA-"? Or will you just appear during the negotiations with Kira and Belseth AND the three brothers and perform an entire broadway musical about "church is bad, Dragobirds are good, magic toasters are awesome"?
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No. 845787 ID: 3ce125

>>845786
It says there right in the update that the past-manipulation is simply making baby Kronos change his mind about wanting to go home early.
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No. 845796 ID: 3ce125

Huh, I just thought of something. If resurrection normally doesn't work via god power because (I assume) the soul is already gone due to Life taking it, we can use reality rewriting to truly resurrect those that died here. I mean Life didn't collect everyone's souls yet right? Just fully heal the bodies and shove the souls back in. If gods normally can't reattach the souls properly, reality rewriting sure can.

I mean Kronos came back to life, thus it must be possible to bring back the others that died down here. It might even be possible to bring back Krotos and Karas but we'd have to figure out how to make matching bodies for them.
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No. 845800 ID: 91ee5f

>>845796
It was already explained to us that we can't do that because we'll just end up with something like this: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=bvpJjbphJWQ (from 4:07 to 4:18 in the video).
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No. 845801 ID: 3ce125

>>845800
No, that before we decided to rewrite reality. Nobody has ever done this before, and the power is beyond that of a god's.
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No. 845815 ID: fe7355

In the end, you can only come to the conclusion that Kira's pride is clouding her stance. To get back what was taken by that devastating war and the Six's influence would be much more than what even this colossal power could do here and now. Here and now this power can't bring back the hundreds of thousands who were killed, nor restore the broken families, nor remove the memories of all the horrors and atrocities that were committed in that war. It can't bring back Briannah's father or your mother and brothers or Nero's sister or Sisah or Doxan or the hundreds who died assaulting the Crypt of the Gods or the tens of thousands more who died from starvation and the untold number who died in the Dynasty-Lorentia war because Risavia couldn't keep them apart. But changing the past, preventing the war and removing the Six, that would bring about a future better than what could be done with the power here and now.

You know what you have to do, and it twists in your heart like a dagger because you know what it means. Everything you've had with Briannah, and with Zela, and with everyone and everything else, and everything everyone else has done and experienced for the last twenty years will be gone. Your children with Bri and Zela will never exist. ...But you trust that in the end a better future will come of changing the past. One where Briannah will be happy and loved, even if it's not with you.

You reach into your suit pocket and take out the music rune, activating it in the process, and let the memory of your and Briannah's song wash over you. With tears running down your cheek you whisper "Briannah, I love you" and keep that in your mind as you choose Chronicler and to change the past.

>…and the closer you are to the epicenter the more lucid it will be.
So this means that Kira and Belseth will dream almost as much as Kronos does of this, since they're right next to him. And Briannah, Thalia and Xarrin will dream somewhat less of it, since they're nearby.

>>845732
>How about this: we change the past, then seek out Briannah and get started on making her pregnant again?
Have you forgotten that it took Xuv's blessing for Kronos to get Briannah pregnant? That magic ain't gonna be available after changing the past 'cause Xuv'll be gone. ...Actually, Xuv's soul would still be around in the past, trapped in the Catacombs and unreachable by Life. But Dreamer said her soul would have eventually leaked out of the broken Soul Kiln/Catacombs if not for getting snagged on Krotos' body. And without all the power from the souls of those killed in the war getting trapped in the Catacombs, Xuv can't do anything.

>>845742
>Really? Not even Belseth?
He's not asleep, so he couldn't be pulled into Kronos' dream. Kira could because she's both unconscious and right next to Kronos.

>What about changing the present, does Fate want to make a pitch?
The "change the future" option is to use the power to change the present so as to change the future. And Fate already made its "pitch" with the choice it presented between either Kronos or Belseth becoming a god.

>>845743
>...but he should let her know that whatever her plans are, they shouldn't rely on him keeping this power because as soon as Kronos uses it for what is needed, he's going to give up this power.
Kronos couldn't keep the power anyway. Without going through with divine ascension, he couldn't contain it. It has to be completely used up immediately, otherwise it'll explode with him as the epicenter.

>>845796
>I mean Kronos came back to life, thus it must be possible to bring back the others that died down here.
That was with assistance from Cain, Fate's agent, to heal his body, along with all those earth elementals, and also because Kronos was under the effect of the Rune of Eternity so Life couldn't collect his soul.

That said, I'd think it'd be possible to bring Sisah and Doxan back and not all the others who died in the assault because both of their souls presumably were trapped in the Catacombs when they died. So regenerate both of their bodies, then grab their souls and stick 'em back in. ...Ah, but even if it worked, as soon as they left the Catacombs, Life would sniff out that they shouldn't be alive and yank their souls back out. It'd take putting a working Rune of Eternity on both of them to keep Life at bay, and that a lot of power to do.

However, I still can't figure out how the Six could keep bringing Hera and Nero back to life without them both turning into either drooling vegetables or raging bloodthirsty beasts.
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No. 845818 ID: 88bd6f

Que the Forgotten One showing up and being like " While all this was fun and shit I'm bored now" and clicking his finger and the world either explodes or we get the super secret super good perfect ending Please Kaktus PLEASE My heart can't fucking take this PleeeEeeEase!!?! or some shit.
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No. 845828 ID: 91ee5f

>>845815
>...Actually, Xuv's soul would still be around in the past, trapped in the Catacombs and unreachable by Life.
Not true. The only thing preventing Life from coming down here was the Rune of Eternity and it was explained that since eternity goes both ways in time, destroying it in the present means that it'll also be destroyed in the past, which means that Life would be able to come into the catacombs and snag all 6 of the gods' souls in the past.
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No. 845879 ID: 3ce125

>>845815
>That magic ain't gonna be available after changing the past 'cause Xuv'll be gone.
Yeah but we just asked and the answer was that it's POSSIBLE. So we just have to find out how. Easy peasy.

As for Life un-resurrecting people, he doesn't work that way. Life is patient. As long as he knows a soul will eventually return to the river, he's willing to wait.
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No. 845882 ID: fe7355

>>845828
But we don't know if the Crypt of the Gods, where Kronos is now, and the Soul Kiln, A.K.A. the Catacombs of the Godless, all used the same Rune of Eternity set into the floor here or if the Soul Kiln has one of its own. I was assuming the Soul Kiln has its own, but I realize now that that I have nothing to base that assumption on.
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No. 845901 ID: 3ce125

Okay nevermind, Kaktus is saying that there's no way to bring back the dead. If we want to save anyone who died due to the Nightmare, we'll have to change the past.

...another reason to change the past instead of the future is, if we change the future people will realize it has been changed, and to the benefit of the crown. This means they will know that it is POSSIBLE to change reality, which is a secret we probably don't want getting out.
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No. 846308 ID: 35089a

hey kaktus you haveing fun
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