>>63093
We have money for the simple necessitates. If we need more, we take it off the next noble we kill, along with their soul.

Things beyond the basics, we manipulate people for. That's what a lot of our demons are for.

I'm not saying money is completely beneath us, just that setting up some contrived money generating scheme is a waste of time and resources.

...the less than stellar outcome in the last breaking reality update and watching the election is kind of making me crazy, so to distract myself, I'm going to build a wiki for this quest. We have enough stuff to keep track of now that it's actually worth the time.

Stupid clarification questions:

Are Infernal Bolt and Arcane bolt the same spell? Or are they two different school's versions of the same thing? (One using infernal, demonic energy, the other using normal, human magic arcane energy).

Is warlock the term for one who does infernal magic or arcane?

Haha! No worries.

They're similar in design, but one uses infernal energy, the other arcane. They're also learned different, the infernal version being an inherited trait from the trace amounts of demon blood in Shax's bloodline, while the arcane anyone can learn, if they have the knack for it and study enough.

A Warlock is one who summons and binds demons. If all Shax could do was hurl infernal bolts, he'd probably be labeled a demon worshiper or cultist.

A Wizard is an arcane magic user.

Shax is technically both a Warlock and a Wizard, although he prefers the title of Warlock.

>>63165
Alright, good. That matches what I thought, I just wasn't sure and didn't want to wikify possible falsehoods.

Although... I honestly hadn't noticed that we had two separate missile spells until I sat down to try and organize all this!

Now to straiten out all the info about the various tiers of the different sins of demons...

I can just give you that if you like, instead of having to ask in the thread all the time. I don't see why he wouldn't explain that to you all in the middle of travel or something, given as you're all in his head.

Only if you want though...

I figured we'd fill in demons as we went, since only ones available to summon matter.

If you want to spoil them in advance in the wiki, or if you'd have us ask questions about demons over here instead of cluttering up the main thread, that's fine.

>I don't see why he wouldn't explain that to you all in the middle of travel or something, given as you're all in his head.
Well, that's just what tends to happen when we're allowed to talk to the character directly! We grill them for information about the setting, their powers, their abilities, etc. Maybe it doesn't make sense that we don;t know what he knows, but from our perspective, it makes sense to ask the person questions they'd know the answer to. (The whole ITQ thread is a continuation of this- questions we didn't think to ask while quests were ongoing, or were too off topic to include).

It's different, say, with characters like Linda, who isn't aware of us, and we more directly control, rather than advise or talk to (we're not her headvoices, we're more her subconscious). We don't ask how she feels, or how her world works, because we tell her how she reacts/feels, and we in many cases know more about the mechanical workings of her reality than she does.

Not to case judgement on this different models of character interaction (I mean, Linda and Polo are probably the two protagonists I care the most for, and they're on opposite ends of the spectrum).

>Demon ranks
Are there demon ranks between the ranks of greater demon and demon prince, or is just a huge jump between the two ranks?

>Sloth
I want to know the lesser and greater demon version of sloth.

>Ranks in Between
The Demon Lords, which don't fall under any particular Sin. Shax is named after one, all members born in the Markov family are. His father is Marchosias, eldest sister is Seere, older brother is Valefor, and the youngest sister is Ipos. Shax's twin wasn't given a demon name, because it was assumed she'd get killed anyway.

>Sloth Demons
Sleepers are the Lesser Demons. Servants are the Greater.

>>63177
>Sloth demons
Missed that completely so I'm sorry for asking something you already answered.

>Demon Lords
Wow that's interesting to know. It's kinda weird that they are named after demon lords. I wonder how the demon lord Shax would react to meeting a human with his name. Here is to hoping that he just doesn't care.

>The Demon Lords, which don't fall under any particular Sin
So the Lords are above the Princes, then? From the sound of it, there was a prince for each sin.

>>63181
I think the lords are in between the ranks of Greater demon and The seven princes. I'm betting there is 72 demon lords a.k.a. the demons from Ars Goetia of The Lesser Key of Solomon. At least the names match from it.

Correct. I'm using the Lesser Key of Solomon for the names, at least, although I'm ignoring the rest of the stuff it talks about for the most part.

Regardless, the 7 Princes are above the Lords. You might consider the Lords to be in a more administrative function. They keep the lesser demons in line and deal with the petty bullshit the 7 layers of hell, while the Princes themselves generally go around doing as they please, and only very rarely issuing some major command or change, and even more rarely coming together in a council type fashion to issue an even greater decision.

http://tgchan.org/wiki/Song_of_Demons

Added a bunch of stuff, feel free to critique or improve the page.

>>63177

Wait, you stated earlier that marchiosas has 4 children(I assume you don't count Shax's twin sister, since she's disowned.) Shax mentioned his third brother who was killed by lightning. Third implying he has 2 other brothers. 4-1 fatality by lightning=Shax+2 brothers. So what's up?

>>63211
Jebus Keericest, that's a pile of info. All I was planning on adding was our current allies and the known kinds of demons to keep track of.

Why count a dead brother as a child? He's dead.

I have to agree though. Just... wow.... that is a lot of information... I'll probably go through it and touch it up some here and there, but otherwise, good job.

>>63217
That still leaves one brother unaccounted for, since it was his "third" brother and the naming only lists one brother and two sisters. Was the other brother killed as well?

Technically, there are 9 siblings, but various circumstances keep each one from being counted. The four named are the ones in line for the Head of the family. 2 aren't participating in the Game, 3 are dead. A full list in order of age:

Caim: Eldest Brother. Killed during a war the Markov family was forced to participate in. Ironically, a holy war.

Seere: Eldest Daughter. Is currently the most powerful of the siblings, although she has only a passing interest in actually becoming the Head, or any of her other family members at that. Trained in druidic magic as well as infernal.

Amon: Brother killed by the Twins.

Valefor: Second in line for the Head. Gave Shax the Voices spell. Is often considered unpredictable and not always playing with a full deck of cards.

Shax: Is the main character.

Ipos: The youngest in line for the Head. Started her own quest for power at the same time as Shax. Little else is known.

Jacob(formerly Vassago): Disowned after he refused to participate in the Game, as well as refusing to use infernal magic. Last seen headed for the Great Forest.

Berith: Too young to participate in the Game, only 11 years old, as she was a surprise birth from one of Marchosias' many succubi servants. She's a half-demon, and is generally doted on by all the remaining members of the household, although she's especially attached to Shax, because Shax isn't either insane or completely uninterested in her.

Shax claims only those participating in the Game as Marchosias' children, as the others are not technically considered part of the Markov family anymore.

Whoops. Missed one. Shax's twin. We all know what happened to her.

Ninjad

Heading towards the Great Forest? I was under the impression the Great Forest was another plane. Is the plane coterminous with the mortal realm or was he heading for a gateway?

So... while we're on the subject of siblings, is it absolutely necessary to kill our competition? Is there a way to subdue or bind them instead? Granted, a warlock soul is probably pretty potent with the nasty things we do, but... a live caster could be useful in their own right.

>>63224
It is. That doesn't mean you can't get there.

>>63226
You could get them to relinquish their claim, if you wanted. There's no way to bind a human to your will though. It's only possible with demons due to their magical nature. If you wanted casters though, it would be far easier just to hire one. You'd probably have someone far more loyal than a disgruntled sibling.

>>63227
Well, just exploring options. We'll have to see how sane sparing any of these people seems once we've actually met them. ...and there's certainly a distinctive to recruitment if the alternative to a partially trustworthy former rival is a bound immortal demon.

>Implying there are demon worshippers and cultists out their who throw infernal bolts, and that it's kind of one of the lower level abilities on the infernal skill tree. As such, it's probably easier to recognize than the secret inner art of a true warlock, of which we know there's only supposed to be one family left.

While it is certainly a low level ability, that still gives no indication on its rarity. We also have no indication on how rare or common cultists are, the faith could have hunted them down until they're more rare than frog fur. Also, one of the last warlock houses, not THE last warlock house. This still does not address the fact that you need demon blood to cast infernal bolts. You could be a cultist without being able to use them, with being able to use them simply being a nifty extra trick to the cultist who lucked out on the bloodline lottery.

I'm just saying infernal bolts have better odds of being recognized than soul nabbing.

Ones the basic spell of all infernal spellcasters (regardless of their actual rarity), and is an obvious offensive skill that could have been seen and reported by witness. Soul binding, on the other hand, is part of the secret art of warlocks, and not likely to be easily witnessed.

Yeah, okay, I have to admit that seems reasonable.

A few questions.

>Souls.
1. Since Demons eat souls, I assume we have to feed ours. How many, how often, do we need to feed them?
2. Is the soul of a magic user of any special value?
3. Can we capture the souls haunting the catacombs or are old ghosts no good?
4. Are there any other spells/fields of magic that use souls? We have unlimited storage for souls but limited ability to summon Demons. What other uses do we have for them?

1) No. A Demon can subsist on a single soul for literally centuries, if need be. The only time you'll ever need to really feed a demon is if you want it to recover from wounds faster.

2)Not to a Warlock. To a necromancer, it has numerous applications, the most worthwhile being the assembling of a mage skeleton.

3)Of course you can. A ghost is a soul left to wander the mortal realm for whatever reason. You can use them just as easily as a "fresh" soul, if not more easily, because you don't have to get rid of the container first.

4) As a Warlock, none. If you begin to unlock other forms of magic though, numerous applications could present themselves. Necromancers are the most common users of souls in their magic, although Wizards also use them. Druids and Priests tend to avoid working with souls whenever possible.

Demons may not need souls... but do they want them? Could potentially be used as an incentive or reward system if they preform well enough. (And if we ever have a surplus of souls that we could afford to spend them that way).

What happens to bound demons when a warlock dies? I assume this breaks their contract. Does this send them back to hell, or lose them upon the earth?

Of course a demon WANTS souls. Generally, however, they want only souls of their sin type, the more sinful the better. You could think of it as the difference between eating a rotting piece of uncooked meat and a five-star perfectly cooked and seasoned steak. To a demon, the more sin, the more delicious the results, along with the power that comes with it. The power won't necessarily make them stronger, however, unless you feed them a significant amount of souls.

A demon is banished back to hell upon the death of a binding Warlock. It's why most demon, once bound, will try to defend the Warlock of their own free will. It's more fun to be in the mortal realm than wallowing somewhere in hell amongst hundreds of other demons.

>The goal of all demons is souls. They serve as food for demonkind. In the case of succubi, they want to add as much lust to it as possible, until they can't push them any farther. Then comes death and the consuming of the soul.

So, Demons can capture souls on their own.
Can they 'hold' the souls then give them to us?
Or do any souls the Demons claim just get consumed right away?

If our Demons can just snap up souls on their own then deliver them to us.... That raises all kinds of options!

Demons can't hold a soul inside them without consuming them. It'd be the same thing as trying to hold a steak in your stomach without digesting it.

>>63282
So... there's no spiritual equivalent of force feeding a filled balloon to a mule? :V

No, no real equivalent. Other spirits and entities might be able to do it, but demons definitely can't.

Speaking of other spirits and entities, is there a angelic equivalent to demons? Can we get more info on sylvans? I assume they're nature spirits like dryads, sprites etc but beyond that some detail would be nice.

Sylvans are not spirits. They are more closely related to what people would consider an elf, but are technically still human. They're Druids who've reached a certain level of magical power, having their bodies augmented by the natural magic they wield to become even better spellcasters. Sylvans are not exactly common, but they aren't rare either. One can usually be found in charge of a group of druids, as well as areas of high concentrations of natural magic.

As for any angelic equivalents, no. The Twins prefer to wield their power more directly, or through human champions.

Okay, where do new demons come from? Is there a set number, and they've just always been? Can they multiply? Is there a process by which humans can ascend descend to demonic status?

Time for the perennial XP allocation discussion, this time for the other quest.

Obviously, we want to keep pumping will. But- we can also spend points to upgrade our servants. Simple stat+ bonuses are kind of uninteresting, so let's consider potentially useful upgrades:

>Geet
He's just an imp, but he's our first, and if we're holding on to him instead of treating him as disposable as his brethren, we might want to make him better. Possible choices:

Improved invisibility. Make it so he won't be detected even by other demonologists, casters, priests, etc. We know there are limits to the effectiveness of an imps invisibility- It'd be nice to have a minion we can keep by us undetected no matter the situation.
Improved sting potency. Self explanatory. Instead of sending people into an angry rage, outright drive them into berserk, frothing madness with the strength to match.
Blink. Imps are dodgy, sneaky, quick moving things. A short range teleport makes sense thematically, and could be useful for getting a sting in during combat.

>Irateels
How much we may need to updgrade her depends on if we keep that artifact lust ring, and if she can equip it for a power up.

Remove human form restriction(s). Currently, one of her greatest drawbacks is she can't use her superhuman strength or seduction magic while disguised. Be convenient if we could get around that.

Question for DreamerOfThings: can Shax (eventually learn to) eat souls? And, remain human (i.e. not bindable) while having that ability? (Presumably, Shax can gain the capability to eat souls by turning into a demon, which should be a high-end demonology ability, I think.) If yes, then what benefit could be derived from such consumption?

None. As a human he's a completely material being, unlike demons, who are magical in nature. While he could technically disassemble a soul, much like consuming it, he can't actually do anything with the remains afterwards, unlike a demon, which could use it to sustain itself.

>>63291
>Blink. Imps are dodgy, sneaky, quick moving things. A short range teleport makes sense thematically, and could be useful for getting a sting in during combat.

Er, could we get a ruling on whether proposed "new" abilities are valid minion upgrades? I'd kind of assumed not, or at least not for imps.

Along similar lines, are there any mechanics for either promoting demons (for example upgrading a lesser demon to a greater) or modifying their base natures (if we fed Irateels that greater wrath soul would she gain wrathlike traits? Is there another mechanic to accomplish a broadening of a minion's powerset?)?

>Er, could we get a ruling on whether proposed "new" abilities are valid minion upgrades?
That is generally the point of brainstorming upgrades in dis. Get dreamer to okay or elaborate on what's allowed, or how it would work, and then figure out / discuss what of the possible upgrade we want in advance of getting XP to assign. It makes the XP voting a lot cleaner than if we have wide open and unspecified options.

For curiosity's sake, would my plan with keeping a imp down there with the ring then summoning it to you later have worked, and if not why?

>>63287
Demons are "born" through concentrations of infernal energy. For every layer of hell, this "birthing place" appears differently. No one has ever seen the spawning grounds, as they are generally referred to. Demon Lords, on the other hand, are humans who have managed, in one way or another, to infuse themselves with demonic energy and literally transform themselves into a demon. This is a rare occurrence, and requires massive amounts of infernal energy. Most were warlocks at some point, while a few simply happened to be at the wrong/right place and the wrong/right time.

The Demon Princes are even less well documented, other than Lucifer, who is said to have been born a god and then descended into the position of Demon Prince of Pride after attempting to usurp both his sister's positions.

>>63343
A Demon can not change there position in the demonic hierarchy without certain conditions being met, one of those being the permission of the Prince in charge. They can, however, be granted power from other hells with the introduction of a greater soul of another sin. Irateels, for example, could gain wrath abilities, assuming she was fed(and she accepts being fed) a greater wrath soul. However, most demon find souls not of their particular sin to be distasteful and almost painful to consume their first time, and therefore avoid doing so for the most part.

Also, for I think, THINK, I can start up an updating schedule now, although it will probably be only one of the three stories I've got going at a time for the moment. Tomorrow I'll see about doing Breaking Reality, it's long overdue an update... fucking classes...

Hmm. The hybrid demon sounds interesting, especially since we have a limited number of slots to work with. Possibly explains the confusion behind Leviathan's element. Lust + wrath seems kind of... volatile though. If we were going to hybridize Irateels with anything (and I'm not sure we want to) I would think envy would be a better pick. Full shapeshifting and mimicry would be a powerful asset to seduction powers.

...one of our siblings is totally going to have created some horrible 7-sinned demon-fusion all soul consuming abomination when we run into them, aren't they.

>Tomorrow I'll see about doing Breaking Reality, it's long overdue an update... fucking classes...
Cool. No pressure, most of us are or have been a student at some point, and this time of year is often crunch time. And as far as I'm concerned, Breaking Reality is still the best damn quest ongoing, and worth the wait.

(Yeah, sorry Shax, but it's no competition. In case of some kind of reality breaking crossover event, I've already got dialog prepared to try and convince you to under no circumstances to mess with Linda and co, and failing that, contingency plans to kill you).

Can we make our own Demon Lords and bind them to our will like demons? We'd have a more flexible minion with human sensibilities.

>>64402
...I would think if we ever got absurdly powerful enough to covert multiple humans into demon lords we wouldn't have minion problems. And if given the opportunity, wouldn't we want to grant ourself demonic immortality, rather than bestow it on minions?

I wonder if we could feed on the energy from the ring to eventually become a demon lord...
Or maybe just feed on souls.