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No. 62615 ID: 5bf190

>>62603

Alright, so: Titans are super ridiculous powerful. Almost anything that it is possible to do, most Titans can do.

Each individual Titan, then, has their own particular nature: Autochthon is the Great Maker, Gaia does Life, the Ebon Dragon is the original Creature of Darkness, et cetera. Having a particular nature confers certain disadvantages: if you gave Gaia a steam engine she would go WHUH WHAT IS THIS and break it by accident or something, because anything synthetic is antithetical to her nature. But contrariwise, within the bounds of their particular nature, they can do literally anything, possible or not.

For an example from the Exalted source material: time is unbreakable. You can bend it to make time go faster or slower, or you can skip ahead, but you can't go back. What was done remains done. This is the ultimate order, the ultimate hierarchy: one moment follows another. But what ho, the one example of the past being messed with comes from She Who Lives In Her Name, who as the Principle of Hierarchy is specifically bound to these concepts. By destroying part of herself, she released flames which retroactively burnt things from existence from the moment they had come into existence. It was a subversion of her nature, which is why it was a self-violent act, but nevertheless part of her nature and so something that she, but not another Titan, was capable of doing in defiance of its impossibility.

So Saulanna can potentially do anything, with enough Titan's Will, if her eventual nature as a Titan encompasses whatever impossible thing she wants to do. And if said impossible ability is not countered by another Titan's impossible ability? But then it would probably just be a question of which Titan is stronger.
1525 posts omitted. Last 100 shown. Expand all images
>>
No. 67550 ID: 5d98c3

>>67549
And now you know why I avoid the Dis thread. It really is like Dis in here.
>>
No. 67551 ID: 08a3db

Regarding the Soul Fire burst discussion in the Quest thread. I think we are still in timestop. We should be able to meditate and grab a moon power for concealing soul fire before we leave.
>>
No. 67634 ID: 4a328b

Hey, had a thought. If we decide to track down the other criminal ghosts, we might want to go for the MERCHANTS; they're sure to have some social skills we could put to use!
>>
No. 67635 ID: f2c20c

>>67634
Good idea!
>>
No. 67637 ID: 406926

>>67634
We already have Advanced Salesmanship, which is probably the key merchanting skill. I'm more concerned about getting Leadership, because topic control in social combat is an Inspiration/Leadership comparison. Saulanna has Inspiration 4, so we need at least Advanced Leadership to match Akatrina or Expert Leadership to beat her. Being able to define the topic would be utterly priceless in the coming social battle.

Of the listed ghosts, the barbarian chieftain is by far the most likely to have a solid Leadership score. That makes them the most important target for improving our social abilities, in my opinion. The fact that they're also likely to net us the most Titan's Will (because of probable personal power and the described retinue) is just icing on the cake.
>>
No. 67649 ID: f2c20c

>>67637
Being able to define the topic would also tip off the fact that we just somehow increased our stats.

A lot of numbers are hidden in social combat normally, but topic change is an unmodified check. It'd be a clear tell.
>>
No. 67650 ID: 370c40

>>67649
There are other ways to increase stats, like artifacts, or sorcery, that aren't covered by our oath. Doesn't prove anything important. We only said Hero powers, everything else is fair game.
>>
No. 67651 ID: 9ee360

>but topic change is an unmodified check. It'd be a clear tell
...assuming of course, our opponents know how how the battle system's stat checks function. That's starting to get a little meta, though.

>>67650
Assuming that the oath still matters. As we discussed before, it doesn't have to still be in effect for future social combat with Kat.
>>
No. 67666 ID: 05a042

I can't help but wonder what Dickery can do for someone in Social combat...
I'm pretty sure Saulanna has more 'skills' in that department than in leadership, so she probably would be better able to match Akatrina in social combat if she could bring those to bear.
The tough part, is figuring out HOW to use Dickery, seeing as for the most part, leadership seems to be the prominent role here...
>>
No. 67669 ID: cee89f

>>67666
Wordblood implied that being dickish could be boosted to intentionally make what we say sound untrustworthy >>quest/491878/ here.

>>sound more/less trustworthy
>"That's more in the range of your own Moon Boost, my lady, if used with your Inspiration or Dickery."
>>
No. 67722 ID: cee89f

>She Who Waits At The End Of Time.

Also "Lady of Entropy".

So, Kairosa, She who Waits at the End of Time, Scavenger of Ages, Legacy of the Forgotten Dragon, and Lady of Entropy.

Geez, she's been in existence all of a few seconds of real-world time and she has four or five titles... and I'm SURE I missed some. We need to get Wordblood some titles.

He already has 'He who aids in understanding'... how about The Unknown Word, Mistbringer, or Blood of Eloquence*?

*noun
1.
the practice or art of using language with fluency and aptness.
2.
eloquent language or discourse: a flow of eloquence.
>>
No. 67723 ID: 9ee360

Honestly, "She who Waits" is a pretty effective title by itself.
>>
No. 67725 ID: 695191

I dunno if we should use "entropy" it just sounds weird in the context of the setting. Even with Autochthon, Alchemicals and their ilk around with their tech levels that kind of scientific parlance isn't going to be well or at all known. But I'm sure Wordblood is familiar with the term, at least.

>>67722
>Legacy of the Dragon That Never Was

I don't think we should apply "eloquence" to Wordblood, as that sounds like a future noble deva under him. Mistbringer is also sorta barely what he's about, not worthy of a title. I think we should wait a bit for him to redefine himself a bit more before giving him titles. One referring to his origin could be ok though. Can't think of a good one there, myself.
>>
No. 67730 ID: 47a120

>>67722
eh, there are way longer names.
See secret's full name here http://keychain.patternspider.net/archive/koc0001.html
>>
No. 67739 ID: 6d4a47

Hrrrm...It's kind of bugging me that Dickery isn't that useful...
Alternate plan: instead of social-fu trickery, what if we were too... Show off, as it were?
Our magic looks weird. If someone knew what to look for, they'd find signs of a Titan.
BUT HERE'S THE CATCH!
The Greenies got stomped, and that happened a pretty long time ago right? What if we revealed that yes, Peregrin experimented on Saulanna, and claim a fusion of Dark Hero and Lunar Hero is what we're doing? A false trail to lead them off the right path? We'd have too give Peregrin a Power Word, which would seal him to us, but it might be an interesting diversion, the setting up of which could buy us time to scheme/ferret out information.
Let's not forget, the Lunars and Akatrina WILL be moving and doing things. I think we can keep Akatrina from trouble with Peregrin, but it will tie him up. We could work with the Lunars, ask for their help in anti-Akatrina shenanigans, maybe even just give them a chance to shred her while no-one's looking, if it comes to that.
Rrrgh, to be honest, my plans pretty much are 'play one off the other', but I can't think of a good way to do that and remain separate and independent!
I feel like gearing up to beat Akatrina's a good idea, but I fell like more important is to figure out the HOW we're going to do it...
I can say I'm not fond of 'independence', the Dragon knows something is up, so we need a reason for him NOT to focus his attentions on us, or at least a target he'd rather not go after. Say we somehow strong arm Akatrina outta here. He goes, alright not willing to talk it out. Fine, let's play hardball!
Cue bad things.
I like the whole 'Lunars kill Akatrina' because it removes the blame of Akatrina's death from us, like if she died in a storm on our land. Maybe not quite squeaky clean, but at least not our fault...
Hrmf, I think we basically did hard mode here. No powerful backer, AND a potential powerful threat that could work all manner of harm to us.
>>
No. 67740 ID: 695191

>>67739
That sounds like a lot more trouble than it's worth, and probably relies on knowledge we don't have access to. Let's forget "showing off" and save the crazy claims unless we already are exposed as something that shouldn't be possible.
>>
No. 67741 ID: cee89f

>>67730
What does length have to do with it? I was talking about number of titles. Secret's name is ONE title. Even if it doesn't look like it.

... NUMBER of titles is largely irrelevant too, but I definitely wasn't talking about LENGTH =p

>>67723
True dat.

>>67725
>Legacy of the Dragon That Never Was

Ehhhh... not a bad title per say, but it rubs me the wrong way. With the way Kairosa explained time shenanigans, the dragon in question existed, the world was just forced to pretend he didn't.

>One referring to his origin could be ok though. Can't think of a good one there, myself.

'The Unknown Word'? As in, 'He who bleeds the Unknown Word'?

...

Well, I like it =(

>Mistbringer is barely related to Wordblood

Eh... i wanted to come up with a title that referred to the fact that, at the moment, he manages the air and water of our inner world. Then i thought of that mist he can create that supports living creatures. Mist is air and water, he makes it, bam, title.

Looking back it's admittedly kinda dumb =/
>>
No. 67743 ID: 695191

>>67741
>the dragon in question existed, the world was just forced to pretend he didn't.
Well because the dragon was made time itself, it went from existing eternally to no longer being part of the present, future or past. Anything that exists does so somewhen, and that no longer applies to him. The world wasn't forced to pretend he wasn't there like their memories changed, he just never was.

Still, the title could be better. I think the only one worthy of her for now is She Who Waits.

>Looking back it's admittedly kinda dumb =/
Well who knows, the elemental aspects of our devas might become more important later. If he develops his water and air powers further that may indeed be appropriate. I think it's more likely that he drops water later though, or at least assigns it to a noble.

On that subject, I assume Wood and Earth belong to Saulanna, and Fire and Aether are assigned to Kairosa. If aether counts as an element, anyway.
>>
No. 67746 ID: cee89f

>>67743
>The world wasn't forced to pretend he wasn't there like their memories changed, he just never was.

Kairosa said that she could feel the echo Haht'hek's passing left behind. The fact that there was an echo at all means he existed. Wordblood remembers him, so he existed. Haht'hek existed, the world just forgot him.

>Elements

Eh, Wordblood got water and air because of his connections to words and blood. Saulanna can't even act as a deva on her own within the inner world, she probably doesn't have any elemental control as of yet. I could see Kai being responsible for Aether (feeding soul AND time element) but I'm not sure how she'd relate to fire =/ though i guess you could say it ties into her excitable personality or something.
>>
No. 67750 ID: 695191

>>67746
I guess the terms existed or not are more difficult to define here. I think what's important is that titans are on a level above

>I'm not sure how she'd relate to fire
Entropy relates to fire pretty well. And fire itself is a form of the phase of plasma - which all that space imagery in kairosa is literally made of.

Or if for no other reason, that Wordblood is associated with books and would have nothing to do with fire, leaving it to her.

>she probably doesn't have any elemental control as of yet.
Control? No. But looking at her personal section of her inner world it's hard to imagine wood being under anyone elses purview.

...We should just ask them who has what elements
>>
No. 67764 ID: 7008f9

Can we afford increased SF for Saulanna and World Reading?
>>
No. 67770 ID: 695191

>>67764
Yes. We can follow any of the current plans, and reassign the 3 TW from generation to Saulannas soul force. That might be the best plan, if it can help get through this mess and score a couple more ghosts soon.
>>
No. 67771 ID: 7008f9

Yeah, I like that idea. We'll be a little better at everything, and we'll just happen to figure out stuff that makes our social maneuvers dramatically more effective.

If we play our cards right, we won't end up tipping off the heroes that we are more than we seem.
>>
No. 67772 ID: 47a120

I thought the reason wood,earth,fire,water,air are elements is because those are the titans of gaia the titan who forms the world.

To assign such elements to existing devas with a different elements is absurd.
WB's element is words, K's is Time.
And mist is a perfectly valid element for a world that is composed of pure willpower made manifest without being a combination of fire and water.

We can certainly MAKE a deva whose element is wood/fire/etc if we so desire. But if we don't then there is no reason our devas have to be arbitrarily divided up between gaia's elemtns
>>
No. 67773 ID: 9ee360

>>67772
You're right, but I think where they're coming from is our inner-world is sort of an echo of Gaia's world. It's set up the same way. And since we don't have devas of the classical elements, it falls to other Devas to manage the elements that make up our psedo-world.

We know words and blood give Woldblood a tenuous connection to air and water, and in lieu of a Deva more closely tied to those concepts, he gets to manage them in here.
>>
No. 67774 ID: 47a120

>>67773
I see, but does our inner world actually NEED to be made out of the classical elements?
Could the inner world be composed entirely of the elements of the devas? I bet it is for other titans and the only reason ours seems to echo gaia is due to having been born of a human (who is composed of gaia's elements).

But I suspect eventually the focus would shift and saulanna's inner world really would be made entirely of her "own" elements.
>>
No. 67775 ID: 9ee360

>>67774
I'd assume restructuring our inner world to follow our own lines rather than Gaia's is something we could do (well, unless Gaia's domain is basically to define what a world is).

It might cause problems when we try to bring things or people into our inner world if the underlying foundations are different though. (People for time stopped planning / discussions / teaching, the contents of our inner den).

Dunno. Best example might be to look at how auto handles it. His inner world is populated, and his devas all have elements that are are physical things.
>>
No. 67776 ID: cee89f

>>67775
Well maybe, but consider that Wordblood's mist supports living creatures. That's all it says on the matter: it supports living creatures.

It seems to me that keeping someone alive in Saulanna's inner world is as easy as deciding that we can do so and making our stuff work accordingly. Sure, we need to make air for people who breath, but other than that, what does a person need moment-to-moment that we can't supply through sheer willpower?

...Basically, our world is not going to be inherently poisonous to anything out there unless we specifically make it so. We are a TITAN. we think, and it is so. By the time we're powerful enough that such a thing would genuinely be an issue, we'll be powerful enough to correct it.
>>
No. 67780 ID: da43f8

I can't help but wonder about using that moon charm to suck people into the inner world, then have WordBlood hold his breath of life, cutting off air to the person.
Probably isn't a power that could be used like that though, limitation on what can go in! The titanic version that works on ghosts though...But we'd have to upgrade it for those shenanigans.
I wonder what will happen to abilities we have a lunar version of and a Titan version...
If Wordblood's comment about Lordly Deva overlap is any indication... That will be interesting to see!
>>
No. 67782 ID: 47a120

>>67776
I think you are right

>>67780
I am sure it will work for mortals but they are so far below us that its completely pointless to kill them in such a way.

Exalted will be able to survive due to their exaltation protecting them from the hostile reality long enough to destroy us. Remember the lunars spent time in the actual feywilds, the chaos anti-reality. And all the heroes originally were designed to fight titans which they did by FORCIBLY entering their inner world to perform violent unwilling soul surgury on them (aka, ripped out and "killed" their devas).
>>
No. 67785 ID: 4a328b

I think maybe the Dragon's Shadow is staring at us in this most recent update o_o

>> Swallow Your Passion
>This power scares me, and I vote against it until we discover how or why it works, and where it's coming from.

I got the impression that it might be a Saulanna specific power, rather than a power from the Moon Hero soul?
>>
No. 67786 ID: d5dfa3

Yeah, I'm thinking that's the source of Swallow Your Passion, too, since that's similar to his to the kind of thing he does. Based on that, I'd have to agree that on being uncomfortable with taking that.
>>
No. 67787 ID: 3bad4c
File 136159983886.png - (42.57KB , 600x500 , tq-autolevel.png )
67787

Voices of the Past ability revealed:
Auto-level Faint images are made brighter. 1MP.
>>
No. 67788 ID: bf54a8

it's like holding your breath. also what is the time limit? just hold it until you are near something punchable.
>>
No. 67789 ID: 9ee360

>>/quest/495307
What's Wordblood saying there? "Why didn't ??? of you notice that?" I'd expect the missing bit to say "the rest", but that don't fit.
>>
No. 67790 ID: 04b86a

>>67789
I think the mystery word is "either".
>>
No. 67791 ID: 370c40

Obviously the solution to this Dragon's Shadow problem is to split off a new deva. because that will only cost us like 5 TW we can totally afford it
>>
No. 67792 ID: 4a328b

>>67791
A Perceptive deva, huh? What element, light?
>>
No. 67793 ID: 370c40

>>67792
Huh, yeah, that /would/ probably work. And even if it didn't, it probably would make TDS uncomfortable poking his head into our inner world. Not sure that's the ideal choice, though, still thinking about it.
>>
No. 67794 ID: 18436c

>>67792
Light bad. Did you not read the update? Scent would be fitting.
>>
No. 67795 ID: 490792

>>67794
scent is also the sense best suited to perceiving the past, might have good synergy with kariosa.
>>
No. 67796 ID: f2c20c

>Upon taking Akatrina's hand, the Death Hero's divine brand bleeds into view on her forehead. Saulanna feels... did she imagine it?... the brush of something smooth and slick and long, slithering up over her back and around her neck, gone before she can be sure it was there. A brief awareness of the other woman, like the feel of a line under tension, is noticeable for a moment before fading into the recesses of her mind.

The awareness of Akatrina is the oath taking effect. The slithering is whatever this thing is we're seeing. I thought both were the oath, before.

I really really hope it did not contribute to Kairosa's makeup.
>>
No. 67797 ID: 4a328b

>>67794
I remember them saying light was bad as a /feeding/ soul?
>>
No. 67798 ID: 695191

>>67794
>Light bad.
Bad for feeding, otherwise a useful element. Not sure it fits that purpose all that well, though. Or is fitting to us, for that matter.
>>
No. 67799 ID: 18436c

No, Light is bad because THE FUCKING UNCONQUERED SUN USES LIGHT AND SO DOES HALF THE GODS AND IT'S LIKE WAVING A GIGANTIC BANNER SAYING HEY IMA NEW TITAN COME GET SOME

yeah

We should commune with the lunar soul, gain self-awareness, then go hunting for a little ghosty.
>>
No. 67800 ID: 47a120

Light or Dark will also OFFICIALLY make us Holy/Unholy according to divine and titanic law. This means weapons, charms, etc meant to be used on holy/unholy beings will start affecting us.
We were also explicitly warned the dragon shadow is very territorial about darkness element and IIRC the unconquered sun is about light as well.
>>
No. 67801 ID: 47a120

You know what... shame on us for enslaving peregrin with a perma geas. (we could have made it last only until we are ... oh I don't know, twice his SF)
Also this could be an issue with the dragon shadow who feel so strongly about freedom.
>>
No. 67802 ID: 370c40

>>67801
It was that or kill him. He didn't HAVE to choose to continue to live.
>>
No. 67803 ID: 695191

>>67801
Huh, hadn't considered that. Well it's not like we can't cut him loose if we so choose, should he be offended.

Oh and I just had a great idea concerning the dragons shadow. If we end up talking to him, let's casually refer to him as "uncle". It'll be good fun.
>>
No. 67804 ID: 9ee360

>>67791
I would think we're plenty capable of dealing with a mental intrusion we the forces we already have present. And if we need to burn TW, we could spend less than 5 to deal with the problem.

And I think we need a good level of thought and discussion before we just up and make a new deva.
>>
No. 67806 ID: 76b151

I think if we do go for another Deva it should be one to hide our titanic nature. As a coherant being Saulanna is already at 9 SF. That's a huge amount and is probably detectable to anyone paying attention. Just look at the Dragon's Shadow. He we can hopefully strike a bargain with if need be. The gods on the other hand might wish us dead.

My thought was making a Deva with the purpose of stealth and the element of truth. The best lies are those with a grain of truth after all. And what is hiding but lying about where or what you are.
>>
No. 67807 ID: cee89f

....

Maybe DS made a time deva, too? It would redefine him to a degree (which might help him escape true name oaths) and would help him manipulate the time in the underworld? In addition, there was a moment - however brief - where we had to put time back in motion for bringing the souls into us.
>>
No. 67808 ID: ecb49b

I just had a REALLY creepy thought: Just where did Peregrin get the data or whatever to start researching Titan/human fusing?
But a better question might be what he's going to offer us.
Peregrin said something about 'other heros' the dragon had... It might be more than just 'Solars/ Lunars/ Sidereals/ Dragons' he hired-He might give fixes to the Curse on hero soul, in exchange for binding them to him/ some sort of hidden 'tracker chip' that let's him keep an eye on the Hero Soul& possibly give him a back door to the hero...

Too nebulous to guess his plans, but I'm thinking we might want to consider more drastic action...
'If you're not in his way, he'll do you no harm...'
Gah, too much guesswork!
As for a soul to create-Let's table it. I feel like it's risky to start making souls haphazardly, giving how unpleasant unmaking them likly will be.
>>
No. 67809 ID: 52d91f

...I just realized that Kairosa is the Time Being.
>>
No. 67810 ID: 52d91f

Oh, by the way. I don't think we actually need a Light based Deva. Our Hero Soul, after all, is associated with the Moon. Therefore we should be able to get some powers that improve the lighting in here by boosting our Soul Force.
>>
No. 67811 ID: 9ee360

>>67807
Highly unlikely. Kairosa got all that stuff on the time-dragon because she was his successor. She could feel the universe trying to put her back in the spot he left empty, and not quite fitting. If there was another time-being in there, I think she'd have noticed it.

If anything, the thing inside us is likely to be associated with another of TDS's elements- deception, or darkness, or secrets (all elements that might support sneaking and spying). Or hell, maybe desire- if the intruder is providing the source of the emotions bottle (freedom from your desires?).

>deva deva deva
...I don't see why the intruder has to be a deva. Detaching a piece of your soul to go scouting seems a little much. I'd really think some kind of projection, or spirit, or avatar more likely.
>>
No. 67815 ID: 406926

>>67811
>...I don't see why the intruder has to be a deva. Detaching a piece of your soul to go scouting seems a little much.
It only seems a little much because in the human paradigm you only have one soul piece to work with. A Titan has hundreds of thousands of soul pieces and basically uses them for everything- the idea of sending some devas out scouting is no more unusual to it than the idea of sending a few soldiers out scouting would be to a country. When a Titan needs something done, it generally uses a deva to do it.

It certainly wouldn't send a Lord deva, and probably not even a Noble, but I'd consider a common deva a far more likely scenario than a projection or spirit.
>>
No. 67816 ID: 9ee360

Yeah, but a Deva's death changes the Titan! And while a commoner's death might have little effect, they're also relatively weak. Somehow projecting a noble or a lord would seem the better option to me- less risk to you, and the thing scouting is significantly stronger.
>>
No. 67817 ID: cee89f

>>67811

>Highly unlikely. Kairosa got all that stuff on the time-dragon because she was his successor. She could feel the universe trying to put her back in the spot he left empty, and not quite fitting. If there was another time-being in there, I think she'd have noticed it.

... Eh, fair enough, i was thinking about that whole 'manipulates the time of the underworld' thing. Maybe a little too much. The fact we're currently in the underworld may still have something to do with getting through the time-lock, though.

>Detaching a piece of your soul to go scouting seems a little much. I'd really think some kind of projection, or spirit, or avatar more likely.

It doesn't have to be specifically MADE for the purposes of spying on us, it could've just been a very convenient choice. A commoner or noble Deva of the Dragon's stealth soul (don't kid yourself, he probably has one) would work plenty well to stay hidden from a baby titan, even inside it's own body.

It's not like there's any reason to pick anything else. A deva will be undoubtedly loyal, powerful enough to defend itself, and easy to slip in, especially if it's a deva specifically made for stealth or deception. It also may have a link directly to the king of DS, as opposed to say, Akatrina, who would have to relay information.

On our own Devas: I think we should grab a Seeing soul next, as opposed to a stealth soul. If something is inside of us, we need to find it and get rid of it - or at least make sure it won't do us harm.
>>
No. 67822 ID: 952246

This upgrade stuff is dragging on way too long. Can we wrap it up soon?
>>
No. 67823 ID: cee89f

>>67822
Uh, from the looks of it, it IS wrapping up soon >.> we've got our final list and everybody's throwing down their votes on what to spend.

Also, upgrades hasn't been the subject of discussion for THAT long >.>
>>
No. 67824 ID: 406926

>>67822
Unfortunately, as Titan's Will can serve as both a primary resource to let us do basically anything and later as ammunition for our best tricks, I suspect that we will basically be debating how to spend it in one form or another right up until this quest ends.
>>
No. 67827 ID: 3dd384

>Level 1: Detect Will Points/Health Points (1tw)
>Level 2: Detect enemy attack/defense stats (2tw)
>Level 3: Detect Heart's Desire and possibly Malaffections (3tw)

Do these costs include the previous levels, or would Level 3 cost us 6TW all told?
>>
No. 67829 ID: cee89f

>>/quest/495530
>Implying that the dragon's shadow is not a social manipulator
>also implying that a friggen TITAN would be weaker in social combat than a hero who serves him... a socially inclined hero admittedly, but still
>either that, or that the shadow would send something that COULDN'T socially fight us into the ground
>>
No. 67830 ID: 3dd384

Another question: how obvious would Save the Moment be if used in social combat?
>>
No. 67831 ID: 354299

>>67829
>also implying that a friggen TITAN would be weaker in social combat than a hero who serves him... a socially inclined hero admittedly, but still
The whole point of minions to have someone to delegate actions you are unable to do. Even Titans, I would think. Perhaps something in his nature prevents him from doing something, that his heroes could do...?

Well, in this situation, the objection is pointless: I highly doubt a being centered on lying is inept at social situations.
>>
No. 67832 ID: 3dd384

>>/quest/495463
DS's devas wouldn't look like DS. It seems more likely to me that it's an inner-world manifestation of some magical effect running off of Ophidian essence.
>>
No. 67834 ID: 268ba5

>>67817
>I think we should grab a Seeing soul next, as opposed to a stealth soul.
Is a stealth purposed soul of Awareness legitimate? Because that may well fill both roles for us. Like how Kairosa has all this fundamentally non-feeding stuff.
>>
No. 67835 ID: cee89f

>>67831
>The whole point of minions to have someone to delegate actions you are unable to do.

UNABLE? Uh, no? The whole point of having minions is to get as much done as possible in as many places at once, and/or to overwhelm with sheer numbers.

And what does this have to do with anything you quoted?

>Well, in this situation, the objection is pointless: I highly doubt a being centered on lying is inept at social situations.

... That exactly what I just said. >.>

>>67834
...Except that the whole point of giving a soul a purpose is to ensure that they are awesome in that particular area by gearing their powers towards that purpose. Kairosa has many abilities that have nothing to do with her Feeding purpose, but her best and most effective deal in energy management and feeding. (As she says herself, she is that aspect of time that consumes) Everything else is just an afterthought (admittedly very COOL afterthoughts, but still). Making a stealth Deva with the awareness element could very easily create a deva that finds it impossible to reveal anything. Remember how Wordblood described stopping meaning as similar to strangling himself?

I mean, i like the concept of a stealth deva with awareness as an element, but you're proposing creating it to fulfill a primary goal OTHER than stealth.

Creating a Seeing soul would get a definite result (assuming anything we could do WOULD get results) and since we're creating it specifically so we can find something that's hiding, we'd pick something very conducive to seeing. (my brain is starting to succumb to sleepiness - this is probably much more incoherent than I think it is)

Didn't we largely settle on a Mask stealth deva, anyway? >.> Or at least agree that we need to talk to our current devas about it?
>>
No. 67836 ID: 3dd384

I have a lot to say about my votes, so I thought I'd make a post over here to say it.

First off: we've got a snake to catch. As far as I'm concerned, that's our #1 priority right now - a foreign body in our inner world is at best a spy and at worst a danger to our independence and agency, and it's probably only trapped here as long as time isn't flowing outside. Self-Awareness is our best chance of finding it, and will certainly help if it's more than just a spy.

As for dealing with the Headless Horseman back in reality, the main thing I noticed is that our offensive options are slim. We're not allowed to use magic to convince her of things, and in any case most of our options for new powers are tactical or defensive - geared around comprehension and information control.

Fortunately, we have a sworn servant who isn't bound by those restrictions and seems to have mojo on Akatrina's level. So let's embrace the role of the mastermind. Set it up so we can communicate under-the-table with Peregrine (Bond of Understanding), and then take the time to watch what discussions she's emotionally weak or strong on (World Reading 1), what she's aiming at with her arguments (Seeing the Tongue Slip), and what kind of arguments from Peregrine are most likely to give us an advantage at this stage in the discussion (Forked Path Oracle). Limit use of Moon Power to boosting our defensive stats (which should not be covered by our agreement).

Obviously, we can't neglect future growth either, and as has been demonstrated in the charts upthread, investment now pays dividends quickly. I suggest increasing Will Generation to level 3, earmarking the proceeds for increasing Saulanna's Soul Force (which, based on my budget's remaining TW, should be possible one day from now if we aren't forced to make any snap purchases).

So! In short, here's how I'd suggest we spend our TW:

[1 TW] Self-Awareness

Then, unless something goes wrong,

[1 TW] World Reading 1
[1 TW] Bond of Understanding
[1 TW] Seeing the Tongue Slip

[1 TW] Forked Path Oracle
[3 TW] Will Generation 3 -> [Earmark: Saulanna Soul Force 4]

with 2 TW remaining.
>>
No. 67839 ID: 14bafe

I'm in favor of spending a TW to locate the presence in here, and rewinding it after we know where and what it is.

Also, I like the idea of a Seeing soul of Darkness and a Stealth soul of Light.
Being able to see what is supposed to be hidden, and hiding in plain sight.
>>
No. 67841 ID: 370c40

>>67836
We can't use HERO POWERS to manipulate her.

Anything that isn't a Moon power is fair game, and any defensive Moon powers are also acceptable.

Also if we are going to make a Stealth deva I'm still supporting Masks, since it was the only element we were getting any kind of consensus on, it's very appropriate in theme, and certain things we really need a deva to cover are clearly under the domain of Masks.

>>67827
It costs 6 to raise it from 0 to 3. Those costs are for each individual level.
>>
No. 67842 ID: 893bed

>>67841
Well, okay, yeah. But:
1) we don't really have any titanic magic for convincing people of things, other than generic boost stuff, and
2) if we use titanic power around her it has to be in a non-obvious way, and in the past "boosts" by other parties have shown up in the social combat interface, which indicates that everyone knows when they get used (though not by how much). Using offensive powers she can detect when we've sworn not to use Lunar offensive powers would be a great way to tip her off that we have non-Lunar mojo (which is what we're trying to avoid, remember).
>>
No. 67843 ID: cee89f

>>67839
Not to be an ass about it, but...

You know there are about a thousand other things we could use to hide in plain sight besides Light that aren't going to require the severe twisting that Light will, and aren't as likely to step on the toes of pretty much every active celestial god in creation?

Also, how would one see with darkness? Judging from how Kairosa describes herself ("the aspect of time that consumes") this would either mean you could hide from it by stepping into the light, that the soul could only see the darkness where it looked, or that darkness would spread wherever it looked. None of which seems very conducive to our current situation.

>>67836
It could be the sleepyness talking but i like this idea.

Also, flip on the lights! Go Lunar exaltation!!
>>
No. 67844 ID: 1ec411

>>67843
Sleep on it. If it still seems good in the morning, a vote of support in the quest thread would be quite appreciated :)
>>
No. 67850 ID: 47a120

>>67839
We were EXPLICITLY WARNED that the shadow dragon is extremely territorial over the element of darkness/shadow!

You remember the shadow dragon, that badass dude who made sorcery exist and broke the celestial calendar to usurp control over the passage of time and only titan to ever escape imprisonment and transformed his wife into a major goddess twilight something who is now converting both solar and deathknight exalts into twilight exalts and single handedly saved creation by defeating the deathlords and altered reality to make soulsteel not work...

We were also warned that using the light element will likely upset the unconquered sun AND the dragon shadow... and actually using shadow will also upset the gods a lot making us unholy by divine law so... basically using either of those elements is a hostile act against BOTH the gods AND the shadow dragon.

Speaking of which, if it is him in the shadows looking at us attacking him with light rather then calling out to him for a parley seems unwise.
>>
No. 67854 ID: cee89f

>>67844
Sorry mate, already used my posts =p

>>67850
I would just like to point out that we only know he broke the UNDERWORLD'S calendar - not neccessary the one for all creation
>>
No. 67859 ID: 491910

I'd say that's The Dragon's Shadow himself. He is "a being that is outside time" - at least in the Underworld and during night in Shadowylands, so our inner time isn't a barrier to him. He's also the source of Peregrin's ability to use shadows as a connection from one place to another. All he needed was a "beacon" to know where our inner world was, and he could reach it from his own inner world through the - dare I say - ultimate darkness that surrounds both. Akatrina's whole debate was a ruse - what she was after was to make any kind of oath just to locate our inner world.

So yes, the jig is up. Let's stop playing dumb and speak to our big brother.
>>
No. 67860 ID: 3dd384

>>/quest/495635
>>/quest/495661
>>/quest/495668
>>67850
>>67859

So on the topic of the interloper...

There's a big part of me that thinks the time to be polite ended the moment they showed up in our inner world without permission. Also, changing the environment of your own mind in a relatively simple way seems like it wouldn't be some huge affront - it's not like DS-based stuff dissolves under the light of a full moon (which is what we've got in here - not sunlight).

Also, I'm like 95% sure it's not the Dragon's Shadow himself, so much as some magical effect that uses his Essence, which is manifesting in a DS-like form because this is a foetal world-body and it'd make sense.

That said, if it is the Dragon's Shadow in person, we are potentially fucked no veto at this point no matter what we do - we have no chance of going up against a full-grown Titan in any kind of unambiguous confrontation. Our best hope for getting out of this situation is to make nice and hope he likes us.

>>/quest/495682
Taking Will Generation now means that if this stuff drags on for more than a day we can start adding abilities immediately. I favored Essence 4 because it's useful for both of our goals (extra HP in social combat, extra leeway for upgrades and industry in here), but it could just as easily be your favorite Social power from that list.

>>67854
I guess that's what I get for arriving late in a game where you can't change your votes.

Thankfully it seems like most of the key elements of my plan are included in other peoples' votes - the only part I'd like that people aren't voting for is Bond of Understanding, and we might be able to get by without it, depending on whether Seeing the Slipped Tongue is enough for Peregrin to indicate stuff to us without the other folks at the table knowing about it. I really don't want to rely on that because it feels like if someone is perceptive enough they might be able to notice it (as opposed to telepathy, which is pretty safe from snooping). Just saying that if we don't get it the plan might still work.
>>
No. 67862 ID: cf39f2

Hyuuu~We're a rabbit, dodging and ducking at every new thing.
I bet Saulanna's gonna turn into a stealth soul of some sort, based in hiding, by my guess...
We're constantly feeling too weak to engage things directly, too weak to do what we want-I'm betting Saulanna's going to end up a nervous, jumpy person- basically like how she was with the Lunars, but at ALL times, and always feeling 'out of her element'... I fear she might just want to run away from everything, run till no-one's chasing her...
Being a Titan? Means she can't trust Luna. Being in the Shadowlands, means being caught in the Dragon's machinations... And if she can't even trust her own world-body space's sanctity...I predict a mental meltdown, in 3, 2, 1....
>>
No. 67864 ID: 3dd384

>>67862
>Being a Titan? Means she can't trust Luna.
I thought we established repeatedly that this probably wasn't going to be a big deal?
>>
No. 67865 ID: 3dd384

>>67864
Nevermind, looks like we've gone back and forth about this a lot as things developed.
>>
No. 67868 ID: cee89f

>>67864
We established that Luna wasn't /as likely/ to be hostile, and there is support for coming clean to Luna. But that there is NO problem has been rebuffed both by posters and our devas.

But that doesn't matter, he's pointing out that that was how we (and by extension Saulanna) have reacted to the situation, by everything from fear to tell Luna to outright refusal.
>>
No. 67869 ID: 370c40

>>67862
This is ridiculous. The only hiding we've done since the beginning of the quest was running from Peregrin initially. And then we fought him, and won. Not telling Luna about being a Titan is just listening to our devas and has nothing to do with hiding. Noone is even trying to hide from the Dragon's Shadow, since apparently he is already in our internal world, or at least some portion of his essence. And the previous holders of our exaltation were all sneaky types according to Kairosa, which is not a bad thing, at all.
>>
No. 67895 ID: 268ba5

>>67835
>I mean, i like the concept of a stealth deva with awareness as an element, but you're proposing creating it to fulfill a primary goal OTHER than stealth.
Not necessarily. A stealth deva of awareness, if a valid element, should not only keep us from being seen/noticed/felt/divined but also let us know if something DOES notice us. It wouldn't scry around or anything a seeing soul proper could, but anything reactive or evasive along those lines can work. It's like having a Defensive purposed soul of a combative element, which wouldn't be geared towards offensive actions at all but could kick ass while tanking. Of course I could be wrong in the combination working at all but if it did that should be how. Perception as an element could also work as well for this, and have more social application maybe? It's a good angle to explore at any rate.

>Didn't we largely settle on a Mask stealth deva, anyway?
The idea was seen to have merit as well as style, but Jukashi himself implied it was a bad idea in irc. Not "primal" enough, I presume. I'm not sure what would be more basic along the same idea. Facade, Aspect, Semblance, Shroud, Veil?

>>67859
>big brother
No no no. We're a child titan, he is our UNCLE.

>>67862
I dunno about that, right now there are just too many fundamental unknowns and risks to consider. Once we know more about the world and get these meddlesome champions off our back we should be more proactive.
>>
No. 67898 ID: 268ba5

>I mean, i like the concept of a stealth deva with awareness as an element, but you're proposing creating it to fulfill a primary goal OTHER than stealth.
Not necessarily. It's like having a battle element of a defensive purpose, which while bad at offensive actionds can kick ass when tanking. Reactive, defensive. With Awareness as a stealth deva would not only prevent being noticed but be aware of who or what did see us and how. Probably.

>Didn't we largely settle on a Mask stealth deva, anyway?
Jukashi implied it as bad idea in irc, not primal enough probably. I'm not sure what would be better along the same lines though. Semblance, Shroud, Facade, Aspect, Guise?

>>67859
>big brother
No no no. We're a child titan, that makes him our Uncle.
>>
No. 67900 ID: 268ba5

>but you're proposing creating it to fulfill a primary goal OTHER than stealth.
Not necessarily. It wouldn't scry, just tell us if we,re being seen.

>Mask
Jukashi implied it as bad idea in irc, not primal enough probably. Maybe use Semblance, Shroud, Facade, Aspect, Guise?

>>67859
>big brother
No no no. We're a child titan, that makes him our Uncle.
>>
No. 67904 ID: 76b151

>>67862
I believe its been strongly hinted at that our Element is Will and our Purpose hasn't manifested yet.

As for a stealth and a sight Deva I'm paticular fond of the idea that instead of Light and Dark we go with some other pairing that are oppisites that don't have such strong connections to already set paradigms like holy and unholy...

Something like Truth and Deception.
>>
No. 67905 ID: 76b151

>>67862
I believe its been strongly hinted at that our Element is Will and our Purpose hasn't manifested yet.

As for a stealth and a sight Deva I'm paticular fond of the idea that instead of Light and Dark we go with some other pairing that are oppisites that don't have such strong connections to already set paradigms like holy and unholy...

Something like Truth and Deception.
>>
No. 67906 ID: 76b151

>>67862
I believe its been strongly hinted at that our Element is Will and our Purpose hasn't manifested yet.

As for a stealth and a sight Deva I'm paticular fond of the idea that instead of Light and Dark we go with some other pairing that are oppisites that don't have such strong connections to already set paradigms like holy and unholy...

Something like Truth and Deception.
>>
No. 67908 ID: 3dd384

We need a new thread. This one is so big that kusaba can't update the HTML anymore - posts are getting lost.
>>
No. 67910 ID: 76b151

you aren't kidding, 3100 posts is causing me ot get an out of memory error when I try to post.
>>
No. 67913 ID: cee89f

On the tentacles - there are some around Saulanna, too - they're a bit easier to see since they go over the few gray areas in our inner world...
>>
No. 67914 ID: cee89f

On the tentacles - there are some around Saulanna, too - they're a bit easier to see since they go over the few gray areas in our inner world...
>>
No. 67915 ID: cee89f

...A bit off-topic: Any one else having trouble posting in Dis?
>>
No. 67917 ID: 520816

Hello! It's great to see that this story is still going on.

It's probably already been brought up before, but notice how the selection of slaver souls is going from "outright evil" to "only tangentially involved in slavery" to see how far Saulanna will go?

Seems like Saulanna's motivation so far has been to remain independent and not be manipulated. If she ever hangs out with the Lu -- uh, Moon Heroes, she could learn about a (massively hypocritical) project of theirs that's meant to help everyone become independent of Heroic meddling. Might be a worthy cause.
>>
No. 67918 ID: 520816

Hello! It's great to see that this story is still going on.

It's probably already been brought up before, but notice how the selection of slaver souls is going from "outright evil" to "only tangentially involved in slavery" to see how far Saulanna will go?

Seems like Saulanna's motivation so far has been to remain independent and not be manipulated. If she ever hangs out with the Lu -- uh, Moon Heroes, she could learn about a (massively hypocritical) project of theirs that's meant to help everyone become independent of Heroic meddling. Might be a worthy cause.
>>
No. 67939 ID: 52d91f
File 136178119174.jpg - (82.62KB , 600x500 , Tentacles1.jpg )
67939

Welp.
>>
No. 67940 ID: 52d91f
File 136178128132.png - (44.04KB , 600x500 , Tentacles1.png )
67940

Welp. I'm worried.
>>
No. 67941 ID: 52d91f

I don't think we can post images in this thready anymore.
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