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File 144033017287.png - (48.05KB , 800x600 , arh_questdis.png )
94347 No. 94347 ID: 8177e7

Thought it was about time I made a combined discussion thread for all my quests.
532 posts omitted. Last 50 shown. Expand all images
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No. 127435 ID: a2cac9
File 154879811931.png - (12.39KB , 811x253 , The Plan.png )
127435

>>125439
>>125450
>>125452
is it me or is deem being cursed the perfect opportunity for The Brilliant Plan?
if we ask her we have an idea to bypass needing to learn to read and ask her to attempt it, she might actually do it right now!

the problem is that merud would think it's the curses talking, and this is not something that can be attempted twice.
plus i'm still not 100% convinced telling him about the sky power and asking for help is what we want to do.
also, the problem of how much we can convince her to write as a test is still there, too.

so four sections:
opening: 'Read quietly. Help.'
describing the problem: 'Sky power broke heart, sealed memories and ability to think about it.'
explaining about us: 'We're a free subsection trying to fix it.' or maybe 'We're a free subsection of deem.'
explaining what we are and the it's not the curse's doing: 'Used curse as cover.'

i'm pretty sure it's too long, and i'm very unsure of the third section.

also, what should i tell her it actually says? (if merud actually knows what we told her it says, then she thinks it works and we'll be able to talk with him again. no idea how to accomplish this)
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No. 127436 ID: 13110b

>>127435
You need to stop
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No. 127437 ID: a2cac9

>>127436
never
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No. 127438 ID: 080aaf

>>127435
The constant attempts to break the fourth wall are not appreciated.
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No. 127439 ID: 10c408

>>127435
Stop trying to implement your "brilliant plan". No good will come of trying to go behind Deem's back and tipping off the other characters that only do we exist, there's something MORE wrong with Deem than the current bevy of curses.
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No. 127440 ID: a2cac9

>>127439
>>127438
>>127436
right, that's exactly why i was asking in the first place. at some point people wanted to bypass the block and ask for help, if it's no longer the case i will let it go.
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No. 127442 ID: b1b4f3

>>127438
That's not breaking the fourth wall. It'd be an in-universe thing.

And by now I think there's something dangerous about what we are.
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No. 127443 ID: 10c408

>>127442
How much of a danger we are has yet to be fully determined, we need more information.

Given what we've learned, though... We're probably only a danger to Deem, if at all. And how much depends entirely on just how much of our true nature originates from sky power. (alternatively, we're some kind of earth pulse remnant and comparatively harmless but that has yet to be proven since it's imperative that Deem doesn't flip out and start taking pages from Alice.

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No. 127447 ID: 977456

Barring some sort of deliberate trap designed to attack people who learn of Deem's condition, or an attempt to bring others in, either Sky-power affiliates or, well, anyone really (Earth-power does form "demons" when left alone, so as much as Deem likes it, I can't see it as entirely trustworthy, so outside agents in general are worrying, but Sky-power especially would set Deem off regardless of their intentions.) it shouldn't cause any problems. Deem's Denizens don't dare desire damaged Dungeon, so just telling them should be all for the good.

I am somewhat curious that no more effort has gone into Deem's injury. There has always been much needing attention, but the boss-lady and ancient artefact upon which the whole project relies both have a massive gash through them. I could see the previous trauma of Hin wanting to examine Deem's heart causing trauma, but that was mostly a problem of not asking and exceeding boundaries. Deem HAS moved her heart since then, and likely will again. So long as she knows what is coming and they don't sever her connection there should be no problem. That should be plenty for a personal examination by the mages, Moriko's scanning power, and Hin's basic smith's intuition. Even alkaline has a monster bond, can insinuate all through the injury, and is capable of vocalising any discoveries.

TL;DR: Focus more on getting them to repair Deem. We won't be telling them much that they can't find themselves if they are able to do anything to help, and Deem doesn't like being injured.

A good message might be "Examine Deem's Cleavage". It should be enough to tell them that leaving her injury unattended isn't ideal, and is likely the only way that we can get good technical information on Deem's problems rather than just banging our heads against her seal and hoping something falls off.
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No. 127452 ID: b1b4f3

>>127443
Why are you spoilering things here?
I didn't mean like we're dangerous, I meant that the knowledge is. Deem either doesn't want to think about it, or doesn't want us to know. It's some sort of unpleasant knowledge.
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No. 127457 ID: 6c2362

>>127443
>we're some kind of earth pulse remnant
Recent posts appear to suggest that we actually have a physical aspect. I mean, you can't throw earth pulse off a mountain, I guess.

>>/quest/919247
> >How exactly would you go about throwing one of us off a mountain?
>In hindsight I don't think I would. You might not find your way back. That would be too cruel.
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No. 127458 ID: b1b4f3

Well, ghosts exist, so we could be ghosts. Ghosts of her former minions even.
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No. 127460 ID: 10c408

>>127457
Yeah.. I'm not going to fully believe that at the moment since Deem is heavily cursed right now.
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No. 127463 ID: 845327

It's well off in the future but I'm curious what people might like to see in that beginner dungeon Merud mentioned.
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No. 127464 ID: 080aaf

>>127463
The dungeon master. The methods of core control would be important so Deem can try and create countermeasures.
Also, traps. We're lacking in those ourself, and it could be good to know the difference between sending an adventurer back to the fountain and maiming them for life.
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No. 127465 ID: b1b4f3

Beginner dungeon? Well considering experienced adventurers can just waltz in and rob the place it must either rely on a small bet and a sizable side business, or instead of the side business have some sort of equalizer in the dungeon that can be activated if a goon squad shows up. Like, a hard mode, but one that wouldn't require much upkeep when inactive and in rooms that could still be used to entertain the beginner adventurers. Like, puzzles that could have some elements removed to become extremely difficult? Or add elements? Suddenly the jumping puzzle is full of spikes or missing convenient safe platforms, or the mirror maze starts moving its walls around...

A dungeon for beginner adventurers should probably have relatively straightforward mechanics and mobs. A monster tamer could put in animals/monsters for opponents as they're being stored for sale or trained, and since it's beginner difficulty they won't need to keep any around to level them up. I'd like to see some vicious yet fuzzy beasts.
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No. 127540 ID: 10c408

>>127463
Lots of humiliated and cranky newbie adventurers in some kind of line trying to compare notes before inevitably going in, getting price gouged (because how else is the dungeon going to turn a profit) and inevitably getting covered in glue or whatever else and then escorted/carried/dumped out via acme trap because they weren't paying attention.
>>
No. 127543 ID: 0cfbce

it could just be really long, beating a few hundred easy traps for a pittance would drive away the high level guys while still being attractive to newbies. so just victory money vs skill level thing. high skill people can take on a much harder dungeon and make a LOT more when they win.
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No. 127576 ID: 1a6fd4

Deleted text from the main thread:
She did. Not a lot, and not intentionally, but she did.
1) She actually can throw any single one of us away. That is, we are all separate entities, she can identify us individually, and we have a physical form she can actually throw off a mountain.
2) Related to 1, she was worried we might not find our way back. Emphasis on "might", which means that we also could do it, meaning that to her we have either a limited capacity to move on our own (and probably identify our surroundings) or at least to communicate with someone else to have them transport us.
3) There is a reason why she doesn't want to talk about what we are beyond the blue "be still" nonsense. She had an answer she was about to give before clamming up.
It's not much, but it's still three more things than what we knew before, and three more things than she would have revealed without the curse, I'm sure. Also, there's a reason I'm spoilering this: I don't want her to know how much we can learn from her slip ups, or she'll clam up further. So if you want to quote any of this, please put spoiler tags on the quoted text, or better yet, take it to the discussion thread.

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No. 127580 ID: 662144

>>127576
I think that "throw off the mountain" thing was mostly a metaphor. I agree with everything else you said, but i dont think we have an actual physical form.
>>
No. 127583 ID: 1a6fd4

>>127580
I did initially think the same, until her answer to "how would you go about it" was completely serious.
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No. 127612 ID: 575ec0

>>127576
Doesn't it seem silly to attempt to hide things from a fictional character that can only respond to or even know about things the author deems interesting or narratively important?

If Deem responded negatively to this kind of scheming before, wouldn't it be more likely that the author didn't want to go in that particular direction and used Deems responses as a creative way to convey that, as opposed to Deem herself being able to "Listen in"?

Therefore, wouldn't any attempt to hide things from Deem be a reductive and futile effort?
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No. 127613 ID: 1a6fd4

>>127612
A quest is, at its core, a collective storytelling game. Our actions have consequences, as do our words (because it's most of what we do). I don't believe Arhra is using Deem as a way to railroad us, but rather as a character on her own right. So no, I don't think going against Deem's wishes is necessarily going against the QM's (not "author"), or that hiding things from Deem is futile.
>>
No. 127619 ID: 575ec0

>>127613
>I don't believe Arhra is using Deem as a way to railroad us.

Are you kidding? Ahra has Deem "railroad" us all the time. It's part of the appeal of the quest. We don't control Deem and our suggestions aren't decided upon democratically. Deem is written to have her own personality and acts independently. She takes our suggestions into account and acts on whatever she feels like.
It's great.
>>
No. 127620 ID: 1a6fd4

>>127619
That's not railroading. As I said before, Deem is a character on her own right, so it's obvious that she would consider our suggestions as exactly that instead of being compelled to follow them. What you not taking into account is that the character we're playing as is not Deem, but the voices, and we do control our own actions. Deem keeps us separate from the rest of the world, so our interactions have been (mostly) only with her, and she'll do whatever she wants to, but don't mistake that for railroading. That's just part of the premise, and if we want to do something she wouldn't approve of (like, say, finding out more about ourselves), it's not an impossibility, but a challenge.
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No. 127622 ID: 575ec0

>That's not railroading
That's why I wrote it in quotes. You're the one who suggested railroading in the first place. >as a way to railroad us

>What you not taking into account is that the character we're playing as is not Deem
Literally sentence four >We don't control Deem

What the fuck are you arguing, bro?
We both understand the premise, great!

Look, all I want to know is why do you think an author would sabotage their own narrative due to where or how contributors discussed their planned contributions?

How is hiding text in thread so a fictional character can't "hear" you any different from cutesy roleplaying?
>>
No. 127624 ID: 1a6fd4

>>127622
>do you think an author would sabotage their own narrative
This is the problem right here, you don't understand the difference between an author and a QM. I'm sure Arhra has a plan on where the story's going, but I'm also certain that it's not all set in stone down to the details, especially where our character, the voices, are concerned. What we get to accomplish, and especially when do we get to do that, probably depends on our actions as much or more than a set story.

>How is hiding text in thread so a fictional character can't "hear" you any different from cutesy roleplaying?
Because, like we discussed, Deem is a character on her own right, not just a plot device. She can have genuine reactions to our actions, so watching what I say where she can hear it does have an effect. And of course I know that Arhra is right here and can read it, but there is this thing called separation of player and character, and any good player and DM (or QM in this case) applies it. I trust Arhra to not have Deem using any information that Deem herself wouldn't canonically have access to.
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No. 127625 ID: 575ec0

> but I'm also certain that it's not all set in stone down to the details
I'm not suggesting it is.

>I trust Arhra to not have Deem using any information that Deem herself wouldn't canonically have access to.

And I trust Arhra won't give Deem information that she canonically could but in the spirit of things shouldn't have.

I believe location or method of idea exchange to be a technicality, and I doubt Arhra would intentionally slow down the story because of it.

The DM cheats behind the screen for the benefit of the experience. Arhra has had Deem selectively "miss" things we've said before. I'm sure it will happen again, and I'm fine with that.
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No. 127626 ID: 1a6fd4

>>127625
>in the spirit of things shouldn't have
I don't think that's the case here.

>The DM cheats behind the screen for the benefit of the experience
And I don't think having her react negatively to our scheming would be in detriment of the experience, per se. There has to be some consequence to us doing the wrong things for the game to be a game, after all. It wouldn't even be slowing down the story, either, the story would go on regardless.
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No. 127627 ID: b1b4f3

>>127625
What falls under your definition of things she shouldn't know?
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No. 127628 ID: 575ec0

>I don't think having her react negatively to our scheming would be in detriment of the experience.
>There has to be some consequence to us doing the wrong things

Yes, and since our scheming is only the preparation for what we do, not our final action, whether or not we hide text or scheme in thread shouldn't be of serious consequence, regardless of Deem's reaction.

>It wouldn't even be slowing down the story
I dunno, story pacing is a tough thing to balance. Especially for ongoing stories with an inconsistent update schedule. One wrong move could put a quest in a narrative quagmire for months. I imagine the decision of whether or not to delay the resolution of a plot point would be quite the serious one. Arhra seems to make a concentrated effort to keep things moving in almost every update, at least when their not playing it fast and loose during the summer...
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No. 127629 ID: b1b4f3

>>127628
Scheming where Deem can hear us is, in fact, the wrong thing.
>>
No. 127636 ID: 1a6fd4

>>127627
Too much to list, but usually anything we know that she doesn't, and in particular any scheming we do to work around her. In this particular case, I wanted to avoid calling attention to how much we can glean from her partial answers, or she'll stop answering altogether.

>>127628
>our scheming is only the preparation for what we do, not our final action
This stinks of metagame, as if she was not allowed to react to our words because we didn't mean it yet. If we know that she can read everything we say in the quest thread, and it takes basically zero effort to write here instead, I don't see why there should be no consequences. If some people were talking in front of you about how they were going to screw you over, would you ignore it because they haven't done anything yet, or would you start being more cautious around them?

>One wrong move could put a quest in a narrative quagmire for months.
This quest doesn't have a singular plot line, there are at least three: you could call them Deem and the Voices (DV), Deem and her Famuli (DF), and Deem and the World (DW). Each of these advances independently from the others, even if they do affect each other, so any setback in a particular plot point would not stall the overall plot. Creating a conflict between us and Deem would halt, or at least slow, all our progress in DV, but wouldn't stop time. Her denizens wouldn't stop interacting with her and she'd still have to cater to their needs (DF), her dungeon wouldn't closed for business and she'd still have to interact with merchants, see what other dungeons are doing, and overall see how her dungeon stands in the larger scale of things (DW). The plot would keep moving, there's not need to coddle us for the good of the narrative.

>>127629
Indeed.
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No. 127637 ID: 080aaf

>>127636
Progress coming to a stop between Deem and the voices does shut us out of the other two storylines, however, and I'd rather not miss out on the lives of our dungeoneers because you couldn't stop nagging Deem to spoil a story arc early.
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No. 127638 ID: 1a6fd4

>>127637
>Progress coming to a stop between Deem and the voices does shut us out of the other two storylines
Well, I guess that depends on how badly we fuck things up. It might just lead to a game over, or maybe a time skip where things went to shit without us, or something like that.

>you couldn't stop nagging Deem to spoil a story arc early
I'm not. In fact, I'm doing the opposite, hiding my observations from Deem to avoid a conflict; it's the other guy who says it doesn't matter. I'd rather we stop pushing her when she's on guard.
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No. 127655 ID: 10c408

>>127638
We really shouldn't be pushing her at all because of the threats she made when on the walk with moriko.

Seriously! You guys keep poking the freaking bear trying to get a response and have been blithely ignoring the magnitude of the situation.

We don't need Deem to flip her shit. And she WILL do it if we don't stop trying to force the issue through whatever means subtle or unsubtle.
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No. 127758 ID: 06bc3b

I am half seriously debating doing a very short quest about someone getting dressed up for a date for Valentine's Day. Who do you think that someone should be?
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No. 127759 ID: b5fb67

>>127758

Alice. She deserves a nice night out.
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No. 127760 ID: afdebc

>>127758
Before-things-went-bad Alice.
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No. 127761 ID: 49ea2b

>>127758
I was gonna say Kallia, but... Alice sounds about right.
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No. 127762 ID: 91ee5f

>>127758
Alice.

The human turned into a plant monster needs to have something good happen to her for once.
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No. 127763 ID: 1a6fd4

>>127758
Huh, this looks pretty unanimous. Let me add yet another vote for Alice to the heap.
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No. 127768 ID: 080aaf

>>127758
A combat cyborg with no (romance) limits!
>>/questarch/754462
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No. 127769 ID: a2cac9

>>127761
what this guy said
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No. 127770 ID: ad51b8

Alice needs some love after all the shit she's gone through.
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No. 127771 ID: a9af05

>>127758
Alice
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No. 127778 ID: d3172e

Yes, definitely Alice.
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No. 127796 ID: 977456

Ubergloom. Why bother choosing a location and a meal when the whole planet can be both!?
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No. 127865 ID: 977456

Speculation time for Alice's date!
The Brute Golem from the latest Dungeoneer update made a fine showing.
If the Dragonslayer's gun is single and looking for someone to love it and hold it... I certainly wouldn't turn it down.
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No. 128745 ID: 29e621

The old Dungeoneer disthread was bumped by a spambot, so here's a reminder this is the correct thread for discussing your OTPs and dungeon interior design.
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